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Gearstix
06-22-2008, 04:10 PM
Hello,
I've recently been interested in diesel engine conversions.
My dad bought a 2004.5 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD Crew with the 6.6L LLY Duramax with a Alison transmission... man it hauls. We had a trial of the Bully Dog tuner.. holy crap..:D

However...
My truck has a 134 cubic inch over head valve four cylinder. It produces around 115hp at the flywheel.:( Its mated to a Borg Warner T-5 5 speed manual transmission, and its got a 3.73 rear end.
Its a 1994 GMC Sonoma regular cab short box fleetside.
I've been trying to find a suitable diesel engine to swap into my pickup. I've been looking at the Cummins 4BT briefly, but from what I can gather it is too big for my application.

I'd be looking for an engine that I can do slight work to to make it put out more power, but not a significant drop in fuel economy. Something thats got parts readily availible. A simpler engine, I guess, would be nice too, less electrical and stuff. Factory turbo would be nice. I've got a few years to work on my pickup so I'm not overly worried about time. Space might be an issue with my truck, but as it sits now, theres a big shroud on the radiator, and I eventually plan to swap in electric fans, which will clear up a good bit of space. It was sitting in an airport parking lot for a year or two before my dad talked to the owner of the building and got it for me. Got it for free. It runs good, but I'm just considering my options.

This is the best photo I have of the engine bay.
http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q106/gearstix/Sonoma/94Sonoma22L027.jpg

And here it is when we towed it home.
http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q106/gearstix/Sonoma/Sonoma001.jpg

It needs body work, and I'm learning that too. Also planning on putting full airbag suspension under it, which would help with the weight of a diesel engine.
I'm 15 years old, but please don't think of me as some young punk. I've grown up by cars and trucks all my life, and I'm taking automotive courses, and fabrication courses aswell, and I can stick weld, mig weld, oxyweld/cut and use a plasma.

Gearstix
06-22-2008, 04:13 PM
I don't need air conditioning, and would like to keep a manual transmission, if that would help.

steponmebbbboom
06-22-2008, 06:25 PM
try a VW diesel engine out of a jetta.

small, great on gas, quiet, and light enough that you wouldnt need to touch the suspension. i think youll have your hands full as it is mating the engine to the transmission.

if you can handle that swap successfully, then you can think about more radical engine choices.

AKMark
06-22-2008, 06:27 PM
Swap an old 6.2L Chevy in there. Put it with a 700R4 auto or a SM465 manual trans. The T-5 won't hold up to any diesel no matter what. The auto will give better mpg, but the SM465 is strong. If you run the SM465 you should regear the rear end to 3.07 to give you better economy. However, with most diesels you may have a problem with the stock size rear end. Unless you stick to a lower power (6.2L would work fine for this) engine, you are gonna blow that sucker sky high. It was never intended for a hi torque motor.

Turn up the injection pump a little on a 6.2L and you should more than it's current motor ever thought was possible, be one of your cheapest options, keep the Bowtie motor under the hood, and get in the mid 20's or better for MPG.

I know they make kits to put a 350 under the hood of an S-10/S-15 and the 6.2L fits in the same place a 350 does. I know because I put one in a Suburban that had a 350.

Biggest differences;

You are gonna need a hydroboost brake system, a larger radiator, a different transmission, probably a different rear end, a stronger engine crossmember and that's just the extra stuff on top of a complete motor. On a nice note, to make a 6.2L run, you need only one switched power wire to the injection pump, and starter wiring to make it run. 700R4 is also an easy automatic to use because when you set it up correctly, you only need one wire to that as well to lock it up.

Lots of good info here, have fun with the conversion, no matter what motor you decide on.

Gearstix
06-22-2008, 07:10 PM
How much is a 6.2 worth? Are they reliable?
I could probably make a new crossmember, and rear end swap I could do that too I guess. Narrowed Ford 9" or something?
The 6.2 is non turbo?
I can get mounts for a 350 and I think 700R4 that will fit right in my truck.
I'm not really sure if I want a manual trans or auto.. with a manual I'd need to hook up a clutch pedal and stuff, or would I be able to use what I got?
Is it a computerized engine?

AKMark
06-22-2008, 08:50 PM
6.2's were used from 1982 till 1993 or 94 in GM trucks and vans. They can be found used for pretty cheap. They are easy to work on. No computers required, note the 1 wire I mentioned in my post.

These engines were also used in Humvee's (H1's to the general public) for a long time. Parts are still plentiful.

I'd search craigslist or here for a good old complete truck and use as much of it as possible to build yours. It's cheaper that way than buying all the parts, unless you get some steals.

Just make sure it works good before the swap. I pulled a 6.2 out of a Burb that had been recovered from a theft almost 9 months earlier and left to rot. It ran great when I put it in my much nicer Burb body and it's 700R4 worked well too. It ran five months (many times idling for hours a day during -40's and -50's in Alaska) before I spun a bearing. Looking back, it could've been easily fixed with a new crank and bearings, but I pulled it and started to rebuild it when I came across a much nicer Body and went to that one, which ended up being a money pit.

Look around here, this site was started originally with the 6.2's in mind. LOTS OF INFO!!!

Have fun with the swap, you'll have a very unique truck by the time you get your license.

Gearstix
06-22-2008, 09:06 PM
6.2's were used from 1982 till 1993 or 94 in GM trucks and vans. They can be found used for pretty cheap. They are easy to work on. No computers required, note the 1 wire I mentioned in my post.

These engines were also used in Humvee's (H1's to the general public) for a long time. Parts are still plentiful.

I'd search craigslist or here for a good old complete truck and use as much of it as possible to build yours. It's cheaper that way than buying all the parts, unless you get some steals.

Just make sure it works good before the swap. I pulled a 6.2 out of a Burb that had been recovered from a theft almost 9 months earlier and left to rot. It ran great when I put it in my much nicer Burb body and it's 700R4 worked well too. It ran five months (many times idling for hours a day during -40's and -50's in Alaska) before I spun a bearing. Looking back, it could've been easily fixed with a new crank and bearings, but I pulled it and started to rebuild it when I came across a much nicer Body and went to that one, which ended up being a money pit.

Look around here, this site was started originally with the 6.2's in mind. LOTS OF INFO!!!

Have fun with the swap, you'll have a very unique truck by the time you get your license.
I'm worried about mechanical failures and stuff, and expensive repairs.
I think I'll try to find a truck with a 6.2L... but might be hard... and might have a billion miles on it.
I'm gunna wait though and see if we move, if we move I'll have space to pull an engine. How difficult would it be to rebuild a 6.2?
Was there ever a factory turbo variant? Would it be worth it to turbocharge a 6.2? I don't think I would but, just curious.

Edit: I found this, but its 6 hours away and I don't have 1100 dollars right now, or I'd buy it.
http://edmonton.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-automotive-services-6-2L-diesel-engine-W0QQAdIdZ55641893

AKMark
06-22-2008, 09:25 PM
I'm worried about mechanical failures and stuff, and expensive repairs.
I think I'll try to find a truck with a 6.2L... but might be hard... and might have a billion miles on it.
I'm gunna wait though and see if we move, if we move I'll have space to pull an engine. How difficult would it be to rebuild a 6.2?
Was there ever a factory turbo variant? Would it be worth it to turbocharge a 6.2? I don't think I would but, just curious.

Mechanical failures in my opinion are cheaper than the electrical ones associated with the newer diesels. The old 6.2's worked well and most of them last a long time. The injectors for a 6.2L are around $50 a piece whereas a set for a Duramax are closer to $400+ each.

A 6.2 is no harder to rebuild than a 350 gasser, in fact I thought it was easier. Here's a decent breakdown on what a rebuild will cost you. At least this is what it cost me in Alaska (where things are normally more expenseive) only a year and a half ago.

Block prep (machine shop will do this and will bore it out if needed) $500 they also installed new cam bearings and checked my crankshaft for this price.

Rebuild kit $900 (had the machine shop order this, for .030 over as that's what the block needed to clean the cylinder walls. It included 8 pistons, all new bearings, seals, gaskets, and frost plugs. I think that's all that was included, I could be wrong.

I paid $15 each for the machine shop to verify my heads were crack free. The main problem was that I had to pull all the valves and springs. The nice part was the shop tanked them, tested them, and put in new stem seals while I reassembled them at their shop.

I had a great machine shop with a great reputation, make sure you find one that has experience with diesels.

Add to the prices $320 for new injectors, $250 for an injection pump rebuild, a $80 set of new glow plugs, a $40 radiator power flush, and about $120 for new fluids, including an extra oil & filter change done after the first 200 miles.

These are some of my favorite trans guys. Bowtieoverdrives.com (http://www.bowtieoverdrives.com/catalog/catalog.php?Action=GETSUBCAT&CATID=B) Done business with them and their products are top notch. Their level 1 kit would handle a 6.2L no problem. Just specify the 1200 rpm stall converter when ordering. For $1K, it's a good deal. You'll pay several hundred for a trans that shifts and who knows what shape it's really in till you've had it a few months. Their lockup kits are great, I've had them in five different 700R4's and by some miracle, none of them has given up, even the one that pulled my 10K trailer from Alaska to here.

AKMark
06-22-2008, 09:28 PM
Edit: I found this, but its 6 hours away and I don't have 1100 dollars right now, or I'd buy it.
http://edmonton.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-automotive-services-6-2L-diesel-engine-W0QQAdIdZ55641893

If you are patient, keep an eye on craigslist, and you might find a steal!

Gearstix
06-22-2008, 09:37 PM
About what mileage should a 6.2 be rebuilt?

steponmebbbboom
06-22-2008, 09:42 PM
just a reality check, take it with a grain of salt if you wish, but id be hesitant to invest that kind of time and money on a minitruck that looks that rough.

for a first timer, especially a teenager on a shoestring budget, id be looking at smaller engines.

remember, that truck has a four cylinder in it, that means to drop a 6.2 in it not only the trans and rear end have to go as mentioned, but forget about the front suspension you have in there now.

and after all that, it's still been wiped hard across the nose.

youre young, this is your first project, lets keep your goals realistic and affordable so you can succeed.

Gearstix
06-22-2008, 09:55 PM
just a reality check, take it with a grain of salt if you wish, but id be hesitant to invest that kind of time and money on a minitruck that looks that rough.

for a first timer, especially a teenager on a shoestring budget, id be looking at smaller engines.

remember, that truck has a four cylinder in it, that means to drop a 6.2 in it not only the trans and rear end have to go as mentioned, but forget about the front suspension you have in there now.

and after all that, it's still been wiped hard across the nose.

youre young, this is your first project, lets keep your goals realistic and affordable so you can succeed.
I've been planning on going airbags all the way around with a 3 link in the rear and a notch.

I'm sure the 6.2 is not my only option...
Is there any other simpler diesels I could put in the truck?
Rear end swap is no issue to me.

Heres some stuff I could get aswell for the 6.2
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=ADD%2D713111&N=700+115&autoview=sku

http://www.jegs.com/i/Dynomax/289/88332/10002/-1

Also, my uncle is a ticketed welder with a welding rig and my dad is a mechanic with a service truck.... so I don't think I'd have any issues with fab/repair..

steponmebbbboom
06-22-2008, 10:31 PM
well, all the power to you if you can pull it off. i'm just looking at risk versus reward. you seemed a little less confident in some of your earlier posts here, sorry if i misunderstood.

you brought up cost, fuel mileage, mechanical failures and expensive repairs, reliability, all good arguments for a small engine (title of your post) that needs the least mods to your truck as possible.

you wanna go whole hog, be my guest. you'll find lots of support here either way. good luck!

Gearstix
06-22-2008, 11:02 PM
Well, what are some of my options as regards to engine/trans combos?
6.2L, what else....? I dunno about VW diesel, im not sure where I'd find one.

Keeping the stock rear end might be a bonus... if I bag the truck, most kits are meant for the stock rear end.

steponmebbbboom
06-23-2008, 09:57 AM
well any diesel jetta should have a nice little diesel in it, they were pretty reliable and great on gas. check the scrapyards and classifieds. not sure about what trans you could mate to it but the broader point i was making is that the indirect-injection diesel engines found in passenger cars would be more suitable to your conversion because they are lighter in weight, quieter, reliable, and also rev higher than direct-injection industrial engines.

6.2 is a good engine but it is a huge jump in weight and you definitely will have to change the whole suspension and driveline. there are members on this forum that have done the VW jetta engine conversion to various vehicles, a forum search should bring up those threads. i'll do a quick look and see if i can point you to someone.

convert2diesel
06-23-2008, 10:10 AM
I know this is supposed to be a GM diesel site, and the 6.2 swap would be a great project buuuuut!!!! if you are looking for a brick solid, dependable engine tranny combo you would be hard pressed to beat the Mercedes 3.0 5 cylinder turbo diesel with the four speed auto. They were also available with a four speed standard but these are a little harder to find. These engines consistantly get 500,000 miles before overhaul and match your current engines power output pretty closely. Have seen some that have been dialed up to 150hp but don't know how that would effect their reliability.

The last ones were used in the 1985 123 and 126 bodies and are strictly mechanical. You could expect well over 40mpg with this engine and maybe considerably more. Certainly won't impress the boys on Saturday night but you won't be spending alot of bucks on rear tires.

It is a little heavy but as you say you are doing airbags and the engine and tranny mounts are easily fabricated. Would have to fab up a driveshaft yoke and will probably have to shorten the shaft. These are a high RPM diesel and most probably you won't even have to change the gears in the rear end. They seem to love 3,000 RPMs (about 65MPH) in the cars and redline (governed) at about 5,500RPMs.

Mercedes used a great vacuum pump on these engines and they were designed for vacuum brakes, thus no hydro-boost needed. Wish there was a way to modify this pump to use on the 6.2.

Lots of parts availablity, reasonably cheap, and there is even some hot-rod stuff available. If you do want AC, Mercedes used the same compressor as the older (pre 93) GM trucks and cars.

Just a thought.

Bill

steponmebbbboom
06-23-2008, 10:15 AM
i wouldnt disagree with bill's input, MB makes a good engine.
the search feature on this site doesnt allow for such a small search term as VW though im sure ive seen a conversion discussed here, but here is some more food for thought, visit this website:
http://www.rocky-road.com/diesel.html
the kit is meant for a suzuki samurai but with a samurai transmission and possibly alteration of your driveshaft, i doubt youd need much else to pull off the conversion. you could likely get the whole thing done and on the road for a reasonable price, especially if you find the engine and trans at the wreckers. you could also sell off your existing engine and trans to offset some of the cost, if theyre in good shape.

gophergunner
06-23-2008, 10:55 AM
Nobody has mentioned this one yet.....but I recall my brother's roomate having a little toyota 4x4 reg cab pickup with an I-4 n/a diesel.

I even drove the truck after the engine was rebuilt. It started and ran great, sounded pretty nice too. But to be honest, it was gutless in even that small of a truck. The fuel mileage was great however, but I think it could have used a turbo.

Anyways, just one more option...

Gearstix
06-23-2008, 11:58 AM
Only thing is where I live..
the junk yards are very picked over, theres not alot of selection.. I have to get my family to drive to Edmonton, Alberta, which is about 5-6 hours away.


You'd be very hard pressed to find a diesel powered car in the yards around Fort McMurray, theres only two here...

The gas engine in my truck now is known as the "gutless wonder". I'd like to swap in something that has a bit more jam, but still want to get decent mileage.

gophergunner
06-23-2008, 02:04 PM
Fort McMurray eh...I spent a few summers up there working. Its only about 4 hrs drive to edmonton if you follow the flow of traffic.

Another thing came to mind, if you decide to venture out of Fort Mac for a motor, you could probably squeeze an Isuzu diesel into your truck. Should be quite reliable and long lasting engine, even if its used.

Just another though

Gearstix
06-23-2008, 02:34 PM
Fort McMurray eh...I spent a few summers up there working. Its only about 4 hrs drive to edmonton if you follow the flow of traffic.

Another thing came to mind, if you decide to venture out of Fort Mac for a motor, you could probably squeeze an Isuzu diesel into your truck. Should be quite reliable and long lasting engine, even if its used.

Just another though
I'll keep looking, and if I find anything I'll post it up here.

AKMark
06-23-2008, 06:48 PM
Diesel engines are getting harder to find in the yards as their demand is gaining with the folks making their own Bio with the high fuel prices.

That's why I still think a 6.2L is a great choice. It'll fit in the 350 convert kit, you can run the stock rear if you don't tow, offroad, or put a turbo on it. It weighs around 700 lbs, a bit heavy, but doable.

I know many 6.2L's above 300K and running strong. Parts are another fun thing. While the Jetta motor would be smaller and probably give far better efficiency, the initial cost of getting the motor would be much higher me thinks and if you would have to rebuild it, I bet it will cost more. I could be wrong, but look up the costs to have a foreign motor rebuilt. INSANE!!!


Plus this is a 6.2/6.5/6.6 site. Gotta promote what we work on!

convert2diesel
06-23-2008, 07:50 PM
Too bad you aren't back here in the East. There are still lots of VW and Mercedes sitting in junk yards, all rusted out but with good mechanicals. Maybe you would have more luck on the rainy side of the mountains, especially where they use lots of salt on the roads. Buy the whole car as there are bound to be a number of bits and pieces you will need for the conversion.

Bill

Gearstix
06-23-2008, 09:11 PM
Diesel engines are getting harder to find in the yards as their demand is gaining with the folks making their own Bio with the high fuel prices.

That's why I still think a 6.2L is a great choice. It'll fit in the 350 convert kit, you can run the stock rear if you don't tow, offroad, or put a turbo on it. It weighs around 700 lbs, a bit heavy, but doable.

I know many 6.2L's above 300K and running strong. Parts are another fun thing. While the Jetta motor would be smaller and probably give far better efficiency, the initial cost of getting the motor would be much higher me thinks and if you would have to rebuild it, I bet it will cost more. I could be wrong, but look up the costs to have a foreign motor rebuilt. INSANE!!!


Plus this is a 6.2/6.5/6.6 site. Gotta promote what we work on!
I missed your post last night..
I'll make some calls around here. How much would a 6.2L used be worth, probably with 200-300K on the clock? What else would I need to make the swap other than mounts and stuff. Engine, trans...

Oh, and the hydro boost, what is that exactly?:confused:

AKMark
06-24-2008, 04:31 AM
I missed your post last night..
I'll make some calls around here. How much would a 6.2L used be worth, probably with 200-300K on the clock? What else would I need to make the swap other than mounts and stuff. Engine, trans...

Oh, and the hydro boost, what is that exactly?:confused:

Diesel motors (for the most part) do not create vacuum like a gas motor so a vacuum powered brake booster won't work with one. Hydroboost uses a line from the power steering pump to power the brakes. You can get this out of any diesel truck, one ton truck and Astro van's use this. It's really easy to convert it.

You will need a larger radiator, if you go with an auto, get a good cooler for it as well. A RV size cooler is only $75 at Napa.

If you can get a donor vehicle, you will get everything you need. If you get the motor on it's own, don't forget the alternator, PS pump, A/C compressor (if equipped), starter (these are spendy), and intake box. These parts are not cheap if you buy them on thier own. If the motor has an A/C compressor, it's not hard to set it up with your current system so you keep your A/C.

Don't forget that after you install your new motor and trans, you will probably have to get a driveshaft as your current one will probably not be the proper length. Having yours modified to fit shouldn't cost more than $300 and if you are lucky will cost closer to $140. A new one shouldn't be more than $400 and depending on the shop might be even cheaper than resizing yours.

Your current guages will probably not work with this motor as your ECM will probably be wondering why the injectors and O2 sensors are. I would consider pulling the dash and replacing with aftermarket guages, or at least pull the check engine light and that way it doesn't tick you off being on all the time. The guages might work if you wire them the to proper sensors, just be prepared if it doesn't. Your Tach (if so equipped) will take a bit more work to make it work. I don't know how to start on that one, but there are some resources here that might be able to help you.

FYI, in a 1985 4x4 Suburban with 31" tires, and 3.54 gears I was getting 24 mpg with a 6.2L, in my 91 with 31" tires and 3.73 gears, I got 22 mpg most of the time. If two 6K vehicles can get this type of mileage, your 3K truck should do quite a bit better. If you can get 3.27 or 3.07 gears you'll probably get over 30, but there are no guarantees.

HH
06-24-2008, 06:39 AM
GM offered an S10 with an Isuzu, IIRC, 2.2l diesel. That might be an easy conversion. Isuzu also sold the clone vehicle. Unfortunately, those vehicles are not very common.

Gearstix
06-24-2008, 02:44 PM
HH, you are talking about the Isuzu Hombre.

I've never seen one with a diesel yet, just gas 2.2s.

I called one of the yards here and they said they didn't know if they had any 6.2s...

Might call some places in edmonton...

It may be cheaper to buy an old truck with a 6.2 than to buy just the engine itself..

Radiators and stuff, I'm sure with a bit of welding and cutting, I could a larger one mounted up.

My truck has no A/C. No ABS, no air bags. Has power steering though.

It has no tach either. I'd just make a custom cluster with AutoGauge gauges.. and I'd put a sticker in the glove box with the mileage of the truck when the engine was swapped.
I'm planning on pretty much restoring the truck as much as I can, and if I had a diesel, I know the engine would last me a while and I could focus on the body or suspension..

I'm going to see how hard it would be or how much it'd cost to get a larger rear end with a locker or posi and narrow it..


EDIT: Called a place in edmonton, they said around $3000 for a used 6.2L, just the complete engine, no trans. :(

Gearstix
06-24-2008, 10:38 PM
I was looking at specs on the 6.2 + 6.5 Detroit Diesels on Wikipedia...

"Common Problems Main bearing web cracks in both 6.2 and 6.5 engines. Reportedly fixed with a combination of improved higher nickel cast iron alloy and lower block re-design including but not limited to a main bearing girdle. These features are in the new for 2007 AM General GEP P400 6500 Optimizer 250-300hp enhanced 6.5 diesel presently being sold to Uncle Sam for the 6ton armored HMMWV.
Crank failures. Related to age failures of the harmonic balancer, the vibration damped accessory drive pulley, or the dual mass flywheel.
The PMD (Pump Mounted Driver) thermal failures. The PMD is screwed to the DS-4 injection pump on the 1994-2001 GM 6.5 diesel utilizing fuel flow to dissipate heat. The injection pump is mounted in the intake valley (a high heat area). The PMD contains 2 power transistors that should be cooled by proper contact with the injection pump body. If the pump is not precisely machined to make complete contact with the transistors via the silicone thermal gasket and paste, the PMD is improperly installed without the gasket or paste, the PMD is installed off center with the pump body, or corrosion develops on the mounting surface the PMD will overheat. Several companies manufacture an extension harness and heat-sink kits. These allow an owner or their mechanic to relocate the PMD away from the injection pump to a lower heat environment and/or a place that can get more air flow."



:eek: Is there any way to fix these issues?
Is there anybody selling new 6.2s? I seen some website that sells redesigned 6.5s, but no 6.2s.

AKMark
06-25-2008, 04:21 AM
Don't read too deep into those. Search this site. TONS OF INFO ON THOSE ISSUES!!! Leave Wikopedia alone, there's more and better info here.

Cracked blocks, they happen, and normally don't affect the normal operation of the motor, and they can be repaired. I had a cracked block, I didn't reuse it, but the machine shop said they could repair it if I wanted to reuse it. Cranks, break normally because they don't like being ground (which many do when rebuilding). You also need to keep the harmonic balancer healthy which many don't verify often enough, and when it dies, so does the crank.

The PMD issue with the 6.5 can be resolved by relocating the PMD to the nostril in the front bumper so it doesn't overheat.

trbankii
06-25-2008, 05:37 AM
I agree with AKMark - there is a wealth of information on this board with broader, deeper, and more accurate information than you will find on Wikipedia.

On your question about "new" 6.2 blocks - the last ones GM installed were in the '93 models, so it is getting pretty long in the tooth. Others would know much more than me, but there really wouldn't be much advantage to trying to build a "new" 6.2. You could do a NA 6.5 build if you don't want to mess with the turbo either due to added complexity or increased size. There are a couple NA blocks swapped into cars posted here on the conversion forum that you could take a look at.

HH
06-25-2008, 07:22 AM
HH, you are talking about the Isuzu Hombre.

I've never seen one with a diesel yet, just gas 2.2s.

EDIT: Called a place in edmonton, they said around $3000 for a used 6.2L, just the complete engine, no trans. :(

It would be the Isuzu Pup, same diesel engine as the S10. It would have been the previous generation to your truck. $3000 seems real high for a used 6.2, should be able to buy a whole used truck for that price.

steponmebbbboom
06-25-2008, 09:08 AM
put down the phone and start typing, im about to make this all easier for you.

www.car-part.com (http://www.car-part.com)

type in make and model, and the part you want.

using this service, i found you a 1.6 jetta diesel for $1100 at eskimo auto parts in edmonton, pulled, sitting on the shelf.

could not find the diesel engine option for either the hombre or the s10. if someone has a specific year to suggest, post it here and we can try again.

the 6.2 should be easy to find on there.

convert2diesel
06-25-2008, 10:08 AM
1984 S10, 2.2 diesel.

Just looked, no matches in Canada

A bunch in the Staes but mostly out east

Bill

Gearstix
06-25-2008, 10:40 AM
Isn't the 6.5 computer controlled and the 6.2 is mechanical?

trbankii
06-25-2008, 10:57 AM
The 6.2 and early 6.5 are mechanical. In '94 the 6.5 switched over to electronic.

Gearstix
06-25-2008, 11:01 AM
I agree with AKMark - there is a wealth of information on this board with broader, deeper, and more accurate information than you will find on Wikipedia.

On your question about "new" 6.2 blocks - the last ones GM installed were in the '93 models, so it is getting pretty long in the tooth. Others would know much more than me, but there really wouldn't be much advantage to trying to build a "new" 6.2. You could do a NA 6.5 build if you don't want to mess with the turbo either due to added complexity or increased size. There are a couple NA blocks swapped into cars posted here on the conversion forum that you could take a look at.

It would be the Isuzu Pup, same diesel engine as the S10. It would have been the previous generation to your truck. $3000 seems real high for a used 6.2, should be able to buy a whole used truck for that price.

put down the phone and start typing, im about to make this all easier for you.

www.car-part.com (http://www.car-part.com)

type in make and model, and the part you want.

using this service, i found you a 1.6 jetta diesel for $1100 at eskimo auto parts in edmonton, pulled, sitting on the shelf.

could not find the diesel engine option for either the hombre or the s10. if someone has a specific year to suggest, post it here and we can try again.

the 6.2 should be easy to find on there.

:eek: Missed your guys posts again.

@trbankii: this was some aftermarket company selling redesigned 6.5L long blocks, and have "fixed the issues with the original engine".

@hh: I know, $3000 was a bit expensive... and no trans, and he couldn't tell me the mileage...

@steponme:Thanks! that site is easier to use than the phone. I had found a complete 6.2 minus trans with 160,000 on it for $1100 on a different site, but I don't have that kinda money right now, if I did, I'd be all over it.

6.5 Detroit Diesel
06-25-2008, 06:12 PM
Try to find user name "Busted" on here. He lives out by Edmonton and usually has something kicking around his yard.

Gearstix
06-27-2008, 02:56 PM
Oh, I have another question I just remembered. How do you hook up the glow plugs? any way to hook up a light like the new duramax trucks have in the dash?

AKMark
06-28-2008, 07:11 AM
Make it simple. Get a strong switched relay. Wire it so you control it on the dash. Flip the switch for about six seconds prior to starting the motor when cold. When it's warm, run for a second or two if you do it at all. I did that on my 85, worked great. If you crank for five seconds with no reponse, stop cranking and flip the switch again. When it was -50 in Alaska, I'd leave them energized when I started cranking, and would let go of the switch after it was stable. (I was running the 60G plugs which can handle extended glow cycles.)

One think I forgot to mention that you need, a second battery. Without two batteries you will have starting issues.

Gearstix
06-28-2008, 05:18 PM
Make it simple. Get a strong switched relay. Wire it so you control it on the dash. Flip the switch for about six seconds prior to starting the motor when cold. When it's warm, run for a second or two if you do it at all. I did that on my 85, worked great. If you crank for five seconds with no reponse, stop cranking and flip the switch again. When it was -50 in Alaska, I'd leave them energized when I started cranking, and would let go of the switch after it was stable. (I was running the 60G plugs which can handle extended glow cycles.)

One think I forgot to mention that you need, a second battery. Without two batteries you will have starting issues.
Thats no problem, adding batteries.
With the stereo I plan, I'm gunna have alot more than 2.

COMP
06-28-2008, 05:32 PM
was it the 6.2 and 6.5's that would crack heads easy ??

AKMark
06-28-2008, 06:13 PM
6.2's, but cool them properly, and that shouldn't be a problem. I've had five 6.2L blocks and only one had cracked heads and it was that way when I got it.

Gearstix
06-29-2008, 03:02 AM
What size rad should I run?
Is there a vehicle I could get said rad from? (Stock one from a 6.2 powered vehicle would be okay I assume, any other options?)

Electric fans an option?

Transmission options... manuals... Munchie SM465 was mentioned, any others? I guess I could use my existing clutch pedal and resevoir?

What would be some ways to increase a 6.2s power, besides a turbo?
I'd have to make a custom exhaust, so I think, and intake and exhaust combo would be one way, what are some others? would like to keep decent fuel mileage..

Would I have to beef up the front crossmember? I'm guessing I'll have to brace the frame. I'm guessing I'd have to buy or make a transmission crossmember....

I'm thinking that a 6.2 stock would be a good power increase over stock, and I probably won't haul much in my truck, other than... haha.

I'll have to put a different, stronger rear end, and I think I've found a suitable swap.. 8.8 read end out of a Ford Exploder...

Anything else I'd have to upgrade?

I'd use a 6.5 turbo but fuel mileage... and my shop teacher says that the blades tend to come off the turbos or something like that..

How big is a 6.2 compared to a 350? I could make a tall cowl hood for my truck, if the engine would not fit height wise...

wade-ve7trw
06-29-2008, 12:56 PM
Converting a 1984 s10 from 4-banger gas to a 6.2L diesel engine can be done however there are a few things to consider: Added weight on front end—a 6.2L has a dry weight of 702lbs—will all suspension and steering handle it.; the added weight of the larger rad; trans and everything else to complete the project.; A rear end to handle the added torque.Will the frame handle all the weight and stress. Putting the 6.2L into that small of an area will create heating problems for an engine that likes to run on the cool side. The exhaust system is going to be a nightmare to install. And when done a truck that is not going to handle very well with a frontend that is overly heavy and no weight on the back end(makes for a fun time in the winter). One solution is to find a compatible sized diesel donner and do a swap that way. OR Use the s10 as a daily driver and look for a full size unit that is diesel all ready and build it up the way you want. A p/u or burb in the same year range will go for anywhere from 500 to 3500 depending of condition and options. I picked up (read stole) a 1985 ˝ ton 4x4 with a new motor, transmission, trans-case for 2500 body in good shape—electrical left much to desire {see photo section-More toys}.
Good luck to you and if help is required do not be afraid to ask and we will help

gophergunner
07-02-2008, 06:35 AM
Over the weekend i just traded my 6.2 blazer for a pair of Toyota diesel pickups......waiting for the razzing.....

But the little 4 cylinder in a mini truck like the toyota is about the right size diesel you would need for your S10. And the guy i'm getting these trucks from claims an easy 35 mpg city driving with the 2wd Toyota.

Just some more to think about.....

Gearstix
07-12-2008, 06:05 PM
We've got small 2 cylinder, three and four cylinder diesels at work (airport ground support gear). Been thinking about getting something like a Kubota or Yanmar engine.

Just trying to find prices.

We have a lil Bobcat at work with a dump bed and it has a two or three cylinder Kubota.. Man its got jam!
Just the 4 cylinders I have looked at have under 100hp. I guess they make decent torque.
I think one of them has a turbo on it, and i guess I could replace it with a larger turbo in hopes of more power?
I'm intrested in evenutally running some kinda veggie oil setup.

http://www.kubotaengine.com/products/v3/v3800di_t_e3.html

http://www.yanmar.com/store/item.asp?ITEM_ID=115&DEPARTMENT_ID=55

Gopher, where you @ in alberta?
I'm guessing these are gunna be a few thousand to tens of thousands each huh...

6.5 Detroit Diesel
07-12-2008, 07:39 PM
6.2 to 'yota? Yeesh, and I thought that Albertans were Canada's last hope. :p :D

Oh well, gotta understand the pursuit for better milage. I'm looking at an 03/04 Jetta TDI.

Gearstix
07-12-2008, 08:55 PM
6.2 to 'yota? Yeesh, and I thought that Albertans were Canada's last hope. :p :D

Oh well, gotta understand the pursuit for better milage. I'm looking at an 03/04 Jetta TDI.
Haahaha.
Working around diesels all day (cept for 200ci 6cyl Fords) is getting me more into diesels..
I love the sound...
I DEFINITELY LOVE THE SOUND OF THE OLD GM DETROITS... mannnn screamin' jimmys... the firetrucks have them at the airport..:D

I don't think a diesel 4cylinder would fit from yanmar.. trying to get measuerments of the 2.2 engine and stuff.
I know one of there 3 cylinders will fit but... its 35hp...

gophergunner
07-20-2008, 11:05 PM
Gearstix, I'm actually from a small town called Two Hills, maybe you've heard of it. I hang around Edmonton quite a bit and of course wherever else i get sent for work.

On a side note.....I don't suppose you have any good 4-53 or 6V-53 Detroits floating around the airport stuff there??? Been looking for one for a project.....

And yeah, about the Toyota......that 6.2 performed awesome off-road, the engine itself never let me down, just the vehicle surrounding it. but the vehicle surrounding the engine seemed like way too much work for me and my schedule to really get into fixing. A good trade for a couple of trucks, not very common ones at that, seemed like a good idea....

The good fuel mileage of the 2wd is just a bonus:D

COMP
07-20-2008, 11:10 PM
Gearstix, I'm actually from a small town called Two Hills, maybe you've heard of it. I hang around Edmonton quite a bit and of course wherever else i get sent for work.

On a side note.....I don't suppose you have any good 4-53 or 6V-53 Detroits floating around the airport stuff there??? Been looking for one for a project.....

And yeah, about the Toyota......that 6.2 performed awesome off-road, the engine itself never let me down, just the vehicle surrounding it. but the vehicle surrounding the engine seemed like way too much work for me and my schedule to really get into fixing. A good trade for a couple of trucks, not very common ones at that, seemed like a good idea....

The good fuel mileage of the 2wd is just a bonus:D


i;m thinking i want a 6.2 in a older truck/burb or wagon :D

gophergunner
07-23-2008, 11:05 PM
i;m thinking i want a 6.2 in a older truck/burb or wagon :D

Ya, I've been thinking a 6.2 or 6.5 would sure sound nice in my old 1970 GMC....

Not too many of those trucks around in 4x4, nevermind diesel as well:cool:

Gearstix
08-08-2008, 12:58 PM
Gearstix, I'm actually from a small town called Two Hills, maybe you've heard of it. I hang around Edmonton quite a bit and of course wherever else i get sent for work.

On a side note.....I don't suppose you have any good 4-53 or 6V-53 Detroits floating around the airport stuff there??? Been looking for one for a project.....

And yeah, about the Toyota......that 6.2 performed awesome off-road, the engine itself never let me down, just the vehicle surrounding it. but the vehicle surrounding the engine seemed like way too much work for me and my schedule to really get into fixing. A good trade for a couple of trucks, not very common ones at that, seemed like a good idea....

The good fuel mileage of the 2wd is just a bonus:D
Only Detroit we have at the shop we work at is a 8.2L normally asperated detroit in a ford cabover with an alison automatic.

One of the firetrucks has a two stroke detroit I think I mentioned, I love the sound of it roaring by everyday.

Whats the chances of finding a 6.2 in Edmonton or surrounding area?
Our travel plans have changed and we might not make it to BC but were gunna see when we hit the road...

gophergunner
08-10-2008, 09:40 PM
http://http://edmontonjeep.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4652

here you go for $800........i'm not sure if its still for sale or not though.

Gearstix
08-17-2008, 07:29 PM
hmmm.
I'm not really sure if I can get a trailer to tow now.

If I do a diesel swap, I want to figure out everything I need.
I'm worried about a transmission. Not sure what will fit, or work. I'm not sure if I want automatic or stick. Its a stick truck now, so would I be able to retain all the pedal and stuff now? I got the rear end figured out. I'm going to use a 4x4 94 up i think ford explorer posi rear.
I would like to use a four cylinder, because its not as heavy (don't think so at least)
Id like to turbo it aswell.
I'm thinking if I were to do a V8 diesel it would be a 6.2 with 6.5 or homebuilt turbo setup.

theres alot of things I'm not 100% sure about.
Went to the NADP August blackout. I love the power that diesels put out, the turbo spooling, the smoke, the noise. I would love to have a diesel in my truck.

A Toyota diesel would probably a decent setup. Toyota engine, and whatever transmission will fit that. I'd definitley want a turbo.

Found a 1L toyota diesel in Calgary, with trans but trans needs to be rebuilt. Comes with mounts, rad, intake, wiring, glow plug gear... might buy it..

rustyk
08-17-2008, 09:04 PM
Check on parts availability for the tranny. My Toyota shop - I've been friends with the owner for years - steered me away from a Toyota motorhome because the transmission is almost impossible to get parts for.

gophergunner
08-17-2008, 11:26 PM
A Toyota diesel would probably a decent setup. Toyota engine, and whatever transmission will fit that. I'd definitley want a turbo.

Found a 1L toyota diesel in Calgary, with trans but trans needs to be rebuilt. Comes with mounts, rad, intake, wiring, glow plug gear... might buy it..

I have a 1984 Toyota 2wd pickup with a 2L (2.4 litre, 2L is just the engine name). Its in pretty darn good shape for its age and it starts and runs like a clock......and your in luck because I'm kinda wanting to get rid of it.

You can send me an email at ssapach@hotmail.com and I can send you some pics if you like.

If you seriously want that engine in your chevy, it will have all the parts to make it run. It would just seem like a shame to rip apart a truck like that just for an engine.

Gearstix
08-18-2008, 08:16 AM
I have a 1984 Toyota 2wd pickup with a 2L (2.4 litre, 2L is just the engine name). Its in pretty darn good shape for its age and it starts and runs like a clock......and your in luck because I'm kinda wanting to get rid of it.

You can send me an email at ssapach@hotmail.com and I can send you some pics if you like.

If you seriously want that engine in your chevy, it will have all the parts to make it run. It would just seem like a shame to rip apart a truck like that just for an engine.
Hmm... why don't you put a 350 gas or v8 diesel in it?:D
I'll send you an email...

gophergunner
08-18-2008, 09:12 PM
I have this thing posted up for sale a few places. So, not to be pushy or anything, but first guy wanting it bad enough and has the cash gets it.

Gearstix
08-18-2008, 09:47 PM
hmm. I'm not really sure if I'd be able to buy the stuff from you gopher.
Don't take it off the market.. if it sells and I don't buy it, Oh well.

I've got another 6.2 question.
If I get a 6.2, could I use a small block chevrolet transmission, that would have been bolted to a gas engine?

76m880
08-19-2008, 02:38 PM
hmm. I'm not really sure if I'd be able to buy the stuff from you gopher.
Don't take it off the market.. if it sells and I don't buy it, Oh well.

I've got another 6.2 question.
If I get a 6.2, could I use a small block chevrolet transmission, that would have been bolted to a gas engine?



yes it can, what transmission are you looking at?

Gearstix
08-19-2008, 08:54 PM
yes it can, what transmission are you looking at?
Not really sure, was wondering what manual transmissions would fit, and what automatics.

What is required to make a longblock 6.2 a complete turnkey engine?

Gearstix
08-19-2008, 09:57 PM
I asked another member of a forum I'm on about a diesel S series conversion, he has a older style s10 with a 6.5 TD.

message one
"
Quote: Originally Posted by Gearstix Hello.
I'm interested in swapping a 6.2L mechanical GM diesel into my 1994 Sonoma. Its 2WD, and I won't be off-roading with it.
I see that you have a 6.5.
I've been told that I can use small block chevy engine mounts and stuff, is this true?
Is there any difficulty fitting the diesel into the truck?
What do you use for cooling?
What suspension/frame mods would I have to do to make the front end support all that weight? I know my application is a bit different than yours, since yours is 4wd and you use it for off-roading.
anything else that would help me?
Thanks alot.


Have you read through my "It's Alive" thread? If not, read through the last post on this page http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f134/i...11/index3.html (http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f134/its-alive-340611/index3.html), it covers what I did to mine to get it in there, but your's will have a few tweaks.

If the 6.2 has the same starter as mine, the drivers side mount you mentioned will work, but the passenger side motor mount has to be moved forward to clear the starter.
That post in my thread should cover the next two questions.

As far as the frame and suspension mods, I think the S10 frame and suspension is up to it if you add stronger coils and shocks to the front end.

The biggest issue that I see you having is fitting it in under the hood. Mine has a body lift and no cross member underneath the engine and it's tight. If you measure how much room you have between that cross member and the bottom of your hood, I can measure the hiegth of my engine and it will give you a good idea.

If you have any other questions or if I missed anything, don't hesitate to ask, I'll help you any way that I can."

message two
"
Quote: Originally Posted by Gearstix Do you know how much bigger it is than a 350?


When I pulled the 350 out of mine, I sat it beside the 6.5 and was shocked and nervous about how much bigger it was. I didn't measure either, but I would say that the diesel is as big as a big block. Probably not what you wanted to hear."

I've sent him another message...

trbankii
08-20-2008, 07:19 AM
Seems to be a few people swapping 6.5s into S10s. Here is a post in the photo forum of another one: http://www.thedieselpageforums.com/tdpforum/showthread.php?t=32502

Curiously, neither one really shows any detail of the engine swap. The S10 forum link you posted has quite a few pictures of the rear suspension but just a couple gratuitous shots of the engine compartment from the top. I'd think that shoehorning a 6.5 into something that small would be worth a few photos of how it was done...

Gearstix
08-23-2008, 06:41 PM
I was looking at some of the military 6.2s on ebay, and I'm thinking the exhaust manifolds that they use might work for my application, or just use oem ones.
http://i18.ebayimg.com/04/i/001/02/c2/3971_1.JPG
I'm not sure if theres more clearance with these or the originals.

convert2diesel
08-23-2008, 09:03 PM
I was looking at some of the military 6.2s on ebay, and I'm thinking the exhaust manifolds that they use might work for my application, or just use oem ones.
http://i18.ebayimg.com/04/i/001/02/c2/3971_1.JPG
I'm not sure if theres more clearance with these or the originals.

Thats a yes. If you go for the H1 or center mount van turbo exhaust they tuck into the block even tighter. The stock manifolds on the passenger side had some real clearance issues with the frame of the Buick, due to the dog leg into the rest of the exhaust. Ended up with a turbo H1 on the right and a center dump from a NA van on the drivers side. If you go duals, use an X pipe after the tranny tail or rear cross member (less boom). If you go single, it is easier if you use the same place to cross over to your collector. If you go turbo...your on your own.

Bill

Gearstix
08-23-2008, 10:00 PM
Thats a yes. If you go for the H1 or center mount van turbo exhaust they tuck into the block even tighter. The stock manifolds on the passenger side had some real clearance issues with the frame of the Buick, due to the dog leg into the rest of the exhaust. Ended up with a turbo H1 on the right and a center dump from a NA van on the drivers side. If you go duals, use an X pipe after the tranny tail or rear cross member (less boom). If you go single, it is easier if you use the same place to cross over to your collector. If you go turbo...your on your own.

Bill
I was thinking of doing a remote mount turbo after I got it all stuffed in and running.
But I still cannot find out what I'll need to take the longblock 6.2 im getting, and make it into a drop in turn key engine.
Its really bugging me... I don't want to get the engine shipped up here, make the guy go out of his way, offload it, and trailer it home and be like where do I go from here?

DmaxMaverick
08-23-2008, 10:11 PM
Military take-outs will usually include everything, pan to covers. No electrical or fuel system, or complete fuel system. Rarely with accessories (water/PS pumps or alt, don't even ask about A/C). You should be able to find out by contacting the seller before making a bid. If you're lucky, you'll end up with a rebuild-able core. Much of the time, the best part of the bargain is the box they come in (if it's a military shipping crate). There are good deals on the Ebay sales, but most of the time, they are not. Finding one locally is a much better prospect. Contrary to rumor (and seller claims), the military isn't replacing good engines. Not on purpose, anyway.

Gearstix
08-23-2008, 10:23 PM
I was just looking at them to try and see what components I'd need to finish a longblock '82 4 bolt 6.2 I'm getting from a member here, and look at what the engine looks like assembled.

thumpertrev
08-23-2008, 10:29 PM
Curiously, neither one really shows any detail of the engine swap.
I did not have any photos of the engine compartment because I made the foolish mistake of bolting in the motor with the 350 conversion mounts before I got the starter. If the frame is modified to use the mount location on the motor before install then starter fitment is a non issue. Also, the lift pump on the older motors is mechanical and did not clear on my frame. I used an electric lift pump. You will also need to remove the factory FI pump in the tank and modify the sender to make up the length of the pump. Heater box mods for clearance are necessary and a/c might be out of the question. Allin all the work involved was not that much more than most 350 conversions. Good luck.
pics of 6.2 on ebay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Parts-Accessories___6-2-Chevy-Detroit-Diesel-motor-engine-Hummer-NR_W0QQitemZ120296664207QQddnZPartsQ20Q26Q20Access oriesQQddiZ2811QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item12029666420 7&_trkparms=72%3A543%7C39%3A1%7C65%3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245#ebayphotohosting

Gearstix
08-23-2008, 10:37 PM
I did not have any photos of the engine compartment because I made the foolish mistake of bolting in the motor with the 350 conversion mounts before I got the starter. If the frame is modified to use the mount location on the motor before install then starter fitment is a non issue. Also, the lift pump on the older motors is mechanical and did not clear on my frame. I used an electric lift pump. You will also need to remove the factory FI pump in the tank and modify the sender to make up the length of the pump. Heater box mods for clearance are necessary and a/c might be out of the question. Allin all the work involved was not that much more than most 350 conversions. Good luck.
pics of 6.2 on ebay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Parts-Accessories___6-2-Chevy-Detroit-Diesel-motor-engine-Hummer-NR_W0QQitemZ120296664207QQddnZPartsQ20Q26Q20Access oriesQQddiZ2811QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item12029666420 7&_trkparms=72%3A543%7C39%3A1%7C65%3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245#ebayphotohosting
I was told you have to move the passenger side engine mount ahead, 4 inches if I remeber right.
would I have to mess with the fuel tank, if I run a fuel cell or something?
My truck has no A/C, has heat and P/S. thats it. Its a pretty base model.
Did you use the 2.8 V6 mounts, and then the 350 plates or whatever that allow you to bolt a v8 to the 2.8 mounts?
I'm probably going to use a cowl hood, if it would help clearance.

convert2diesel
08-24-2008, 08:34 AM
would I have to mess with the fuel tank, if I run a fuel cell or something?

If the original truck was carburated or used throttle body injection, then you won't have to change out the in-tank pump. Pressure is fine for the IP. It's only the newer multi-port injection systems that use the high pressure pumps. Ran the Buick on the in-tank for about 2 years until it went to greener pastures. Replaced it with an in-line pump from NAPA for about 50 bucks. The new pump draws through the old pump fine. No need to even drop the tank. Kept the chassis fuel filter in place as added insurance, though it is a pain to replace, and used the older style box type diesel filter used in the earlier models of 6.2 trucks.

Bill

Gearstix
08-24-2008, 12:49 PM
If the original truck was carburated or used throttle body injection, then you won't have to change out the in-tank pump. Pressure is fine for the IP. It's only the newer multi-port injection systems that use the high pressure pumps. Ran the Buick on the in-tank for about 2 years until it went to greener pastures. Replaced it with an in-line pump from NAPA for about 50 bucks. The new pump draws through the old pump fine. No need to even drop the tank. Kept the chassis fuel filter in place as added insurance, though it is a pain to replace, and used the older style box type diesel filter used in the earlier models of 6.2 trucks.

Bill
My truck is a fuel injected four cylinder right now.
http://www.s10v8.com/store/product_info.php/products_id/49

Can I use that? it has an adjustable regulator.

convert2diesel
08-24-2008, 03:21 PM
My truck is a fuel injected four cylinder right now.
http://www.s10v8.com/store/product_info.php/products_id/49

Can I use that? it has an adjustable regulator.

Yes that regulator will work but I would check fuel rail pressure first. From your original picture, it looks like your truck is throttle body injected and as such would be using the low pressure pump. No need for the regulator.

Bill

Gearstix
08-24-2008, 09:18 PM
Yes that regulator will work but I would check fuel rail pressure first. From your original picture, it looks like your truck is throttle body injected and as such would be using the low pressure pump. No need for the regulator.

Bill
It is throttle body injected, I forgot.

Would there be any problems running diesel through the existing fuel system?

DmaxMaverick
08-24-2008, 10:18 PM
It is throttle body injected, I forgot.

Would there be any problems running diesel through the existing fuel system?

No. But you'll need to install a return line to the tank.

Gearstix
08-24-2008, 10:46 PM
I was just thinking about brakes with the diesel, and it was mentioned that id have to convert to a hydroboost configuration.
I'm pretty sure I saw something about a vaccum pump that would let you use the original brakes.

DmaxMaverick
08-24-2008, 10:55 PM
You could use an electric vacuum pump designed for it. They are noisy, and don't last long.

Gearstix
08-24-2008, 11:45 PM
So the best way to setup the brakes would be a hydroboost setup?
is there any other issues like this when converting from gas > diesel?

Gearstix
08-27-2008, 05:46 PM
Well I have found a 6.2.
Were moving into a new house soon too, and I get my own garage bay.. yay.
So I'll have space to work on it.
Should I go ahead with getting the engine and gathering the parts?
I'm a bit worried, but I tend to overthink things.
Plus I'm not in a rush so..

DmaxMaverick
08-27-2008, 08:44 PM
You have to start somewhere. Lofty goals often lead to very acceptable results. Once you have the engine staring at you, it has to go somewhere. It depends on you determination from there.

Gearstix
08-28-2008, 06:35 PM
A buddy of mine in Indianna is going to college and he says he can do a 700R4 for 820 shipped, depending on how much he gets the trans for.
Is the only difference between the gas and diesel 700R4 is the torque converter?
He says it'll have a shift kit and stuff.
Good deal or pass? it'll be a rebuild transmission.

DmaxMaverick
08-28-2008, 09:28 PM
A buddy of mine in Indianna is going to college and he says he can do a 700R4 for 820 shipped, depending on how much he gets the trans for.
Is the only difference between the gas and diesel 700R4 is the torque converter?
He says it'll have a shift kit and stuff.
Good deal or pass? it'll be a rebuild transmission.

.....and the governor.

Gearstix
09-10-2008, 11:04 PM
I'm still wondering what transmission would be easiest to adapt in. I'm thinking 4.3L V6 s10 trans (will bolt to the diesel), its just finding one is the problem...

convert2diesel
09-11-2008, 06:25 AM
.....and the governor.

and the throttle valve and the accululator piston.

Bill

Gearstix
09-12-2008, 12:56 PM
I'm pretty sure the S10 v6 5 speed (New Venture Gear 3500) is my best bet.
Just gotta find one is the problem

trbankii
09-12-2008, 06:34 PM
Not sure that the NV3500 will hold up to a diesel. The diesels had the NV4500. Should be fairly easy to turn up one, though. They were in quite a number of applications.

Gearstix
09-13-2008, 10:00 AM
Well I was sent a link to a guy on another forum who put one in his sierra or soemthing, it had a 6.2

I don't know if a automatic would be better, but ..
all the work to put one in plus I'd need to covert the gasser transmission.

Gearstix
10-14-2008, 08:26 PM
Guys, this swap will go ahead, but very slowly. The engine will be delivered when it can and I'm not in a rush. I'm going to gather up the parts. I will start to look for a transmission.
:D

6.5 Detroit Diesel
10-14-2008, 09:43 PM
The NV3500 should do the trick. Yes it is smaller than the NV4500 but here is how I see it.
The truck is much lighter than your typical 6.2 application.
There is no transfer case and front drive shaft to push
It is a N/A engine
And he won't be towing much with it.
In my buddys truck(1995 2500 6 bolt), he has the NV3500. It is a Ext Cab/Short box 4X4. It has the TBI 350 which is rated from the book for 1995 at 225HP and 320 torque, and he has done a few things to make the engine "Healthier". He has towed between 5-6,000 lbs with the truck over the Coquihalla highway, which anyone who has driven knows can have some very nasty grades. The tranny has held up fine. Keep in mind that his son has driven it, I drove it repeatedly, and it was formerly my brothers truck, so it has been mildly thrashed on.
The NV3500 will do fine behind a 6.2 in a light truck. We have 3 or 4 sitting in Pick Your Part.

hatzie55
10-16-2008, 05:50 AM
The NV3500 has a torque rating of @300ft/lb. I decided against it for my 6.5 NA engine. If your engine will not exceed 300ft/lb you should not have any problems with it.

6.5 Detroit Diesel
10-17-2008, 11:56 PM
Most power rated from a 6.2 is 280/factory torque. I think. :o

Gearstix
10-19-2008, 10:10 PM
I've been thinking if I got all the parts from a V6 S10/Sonoma, a Nv3500 would drop right in.
I haven't been able to find one yet.

Kinda thinking of something a bit stronger.. maybe Turbo 350, Turbo 400, some manual trans...

Hey 6.5 DD,
is there any 6.2s that have stuff like alt brackets and pullies and stuff out your way?

6.5 Detroit Diesel
10-20-2008, 08:10 PM
There is one complete 6.2 sitting at PYP as far as I know.

Gearstix
10-20-2008, 10:24 PM
Hmmm. I don't need all of it haha.
Not sure 100% what I need. I'm kinda waiting to see if I get the engine first..

If I could get a list of all the things that the engine needss.. I know some of it.

He said, pulleys, fan, alt bracket, injection pump( was gunna buy new)...alternator.. not sure what else

Gearstix
10-25-2008, 06:05 PM
Hmm...
"gas to diesel conversions"

http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f42/i-cant-really-decide-373836/

curmudge1
10-27-2008, 11:33 AM
While the 6.2 may be the most practical & cost-effective, I recall that Isusu offered a diesel option for their Trooper. Did anyone have any experience with that rig that they would care to share?

Might be a bit smaller & lighter than a 6.2, *IF* you can find one reasonable.

Just another thought. Good luck with your project.

--
Dave

R/Cpullerdude
10-30-2008, 09:02 PM
I would ignore those guys at the S10 forum, they've made it more than obvious that they haven't a clue what they're talking about.

As I'm sure has been mentioned on this forum, the 6.2 was designed from the ground up by Detroit Diesel as a Diesel. The 6.2 (6.5) if pushed, will make about 300 horses and still be reliable. In the end they are very reliable engines, can make decent power, and are realitivly cheap and easy to maintain.

I'd say go for it and run. If you can find the room and money, maybe even through a 6.5 turbo on it. Good luck with it. I think this'll be one awesome truck.

6.5 Detroit Diesel
10-30-2008, 11:19 PM
Only thing is, he is trying to keep this as low cost as possible. Building a 6.2 up to a real 300HP would be a decent investment when it was all said and done. Not to mention, by going with an engine that hot, he is going to need a stronger tranny, axle...

R/Cpullerdude
10-31-2008, 05:23 AM
Only thing is, he is trying to keep this as low cost as possible. Building a 6.2 up to a real 300HP would be a decent investment when it was all said and done. Not to mention, by going with an engine that hot, he is going to need a stronger tranny, axle...


If you notice, I didn't suggest for him to build it up that much, but rather mentioned it to disprove all the guys on that forum he linked to that said it was a POS converted gasser that made low torque with low RPM's, no horsepower, and was gutless.

trbankii
10-31-2008, 05:43 AM
I agree with R/C on the opinion of the "information" you're getting over at the S10 forum. Anyone calling the 6.2/6.5 a "converted gasser" obviously has no experience with them.

About the only valid information over there is concerning what motives you have for doing the swap. If you're looking for fuel economy, you're likely ahead leaving it the way that it is and freshening things up a bit. Figuring the time, money, and engineering that will go into such a swap you're never going to recoup your expenses in mileage.

If you're looking for something unique and looking for a project for the sake of doing a project - by all means go for it!

6.5 Detroit Diesel
10-31-2008, 10:45 AM
If you notice, I didn't suggest for him to build it up that much, but rather mentioned it to disprove all the guys on that forum he linked to that said it was a POS converted gasser that made low torque with low RPM's, no horsepower, and was gutless.

Easy, not running you down, simply stating was he has shared with us already. No offense meant. I don't think there are any on this forum that believe in the converted gasser theory anymore :D

R/Cpullerdude
10-31-2008, 11:43 AM
Easy, not running you down, simply stating was he has shared with us already. No offense meant. I don't think there are any on this forum that believe in the converted gasser theory anymore :D

No harm, no foul, didn't feel offended at all, sorry if I came off that way.

6.5 Detroit Diesel
11-05-2008, 09:23 PM
Just going back and reading over the posts a bit. When talking about rearends it would be interested to compare the little 7.5" rearend behind a 6.2 and a 8.5" behind a 6.5TD. We have run a stock 8.5" Gov-Lok behind a 95' 6.5TD that my friend drives like a grandma. (Ya right! :D) It only recently gave out. The truck has 480,000 kms on it and the rearend was put through many breakstand attempts. I was just thinking that he might be able to get away with leaving the stock rearend in if he is building a stock spec 6.2 setup. Just a thought....

NeilLB7
12-04-2008, 08:21 AM
Personally...I'd do a Cummins 4 or 3 cyl swap. They are well established swaps and I've seen many of them in small vehicles including Jeeps etc. Easy to find and work on.

http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/index.php

Just a thought.

Dieselmania
01-02-2009, 06:05 PM
I have read a lot of the suggestions posted here. A 6.2/6.5 could be "shoehorned" between the fenderwells, but the guy that said it would fit where a 350 came out....isn't necessarily correct. The width of the 6.2/6.5 engines with exhaust manifolds mounted is more comparable to that of a big block gasser such as a 396, 402,427, or 454. True the motormounts and bell housings are in the exact same locations, but the top end of the motor is wider than a small block V-8, and will not easily fit between your fender wells ( I know because I have stuffed a few S-10 engine bays with 350 V-8s ). If its economy you are looking for, I would suggest replacing the 2.2 with a small 4 cyl diesel such as one from a bobcat skidloader. The engines are about the same physical size as your 2.2, and an easily made adapter plate to bolt the transmission ( auto or manual ) to the bell housing. A 6.2/6.5 would be like planting a 350 under your hood, and you'ld have to change the rear axle, tranny, and wind up spending a ot more than necessary....and in the end not get much better fuel economy than you currently get with the 2.2....considering the difference in the price of diesel over unleaded regular. The suggestion to put a VW diesel in could work, but you would see more usable power from the commercial equipment 4 cyl than you would the tiny VW. If you ever decided to pull a trailer, the VW would have a lot of trouble getting motivated as well. They were designed for VERY light vehicles....not something like an S-10. Another consideration would be a small inline 6cyl Diesel such as from a Nissan Cressida. I know a gentleman who put a toyota 6cyl diesel in his 1978 F100 ford pickup, and it does great and is very economical....and with a turbo, has good power too.... Like some have said, it all depends on your goal in the end, and what you plan on using the truck for. With Fabrication, you could slam a big 3406 cat diesel in the engine bay if its pulling power you want.

Gearstix
01-14-2009, 04:20 PM
I was thinking a gas 350.. I dunno.. I just love how my dads Duramax performs.. I figured if I had a 'toned down' diesel in my truck, it be fun to drive and reasonable on fuel costs.

I've been thinking of the Cummins engines.. the 4BT I think...? it seems too tall and too long.. I may have gotten the wrong measurements.

I want something thats 'fun to drive' and decent on fuel. I'd be happy with a inline engine.. I just want something better than the 88whp 2.2 I got. Its got a few more KMs on it that I'd like..

an inline would probably do me better. I've also been researching putting a GM gas I6 in it, but thats sorta a touchy subject.

I'm definitley not building a 4x4 off road machine. I want a small nice to drive minitruck.. I don't think the 2.2 will do well on the highway..

The guy on here with the 6.2 is moving closer to me.. so that might be okay...

I got most of the bodywork done on my pickup as it sits.

It has a Borg Warner T-5 transmission. 5 speed manual. Non World Class, has a GM 4 cylinder bellhousing and has a Ford bolt pattern where the bell bolts to the trans.

an inline would probably fair me better, especially if I do airbags on four corners (yeah probably gunna get hated on this but its something i've always wanted)
and with an inline there'd be more space on the sides of the motor.

I'm not sure where i'd get a bobcat engine or whatever..
I had fun playing around with the small diesels I worked with. 3 cylinders most of them, john deeres, bobcats...

at least with a diesel it isn't too hard to get more power out of them.. turbocharger... larger injectors, propane injection, etc. But I'm not going for dragtruck performance. A balance between power and fuel economy would be nice..

The 2.2 is said to get anywhere from 20-25mpg I think... but you'd have to drive it like a grandmother. I will be driving normally most of the time, but hills and passing stuff on the highway.. I want some more balls.

I'm not really wanting a computerized engine to swap in though, thats why the 6.2 was appealing.

gophergunner
01-14-2009, 09:50 PM
I will donate you a Toyota 2L diesel.....needs rebuilding as its all in pieces right now. And its actually 2.4 Litres I believe, 2L is just the model of the engine. However, with the work it needs done, I was quoted $5600 to get it running again.:confused:

Or if you happen to luck out and find a wrecked right hand drive Toyota pickup that has a diesel engine, you might be able to put it in your truck. The newer engines (3L i believe) were more powerful and more reliable.

I only suggest Toyota as they have made a few small trucks with diesel engines.....turbo diesels as well.

If you're feeling ambitious, there is a machine shop in Edmonton that deals lots with import motors and the guy there might be able to help you out.

http://www.ecauto.ca/contact_us.htm

Guy that i talked to was Mike.

Good luck if you choose to go that route.

Gearstix
01-15-2009, 05:56 PM
I will donate you a Toyota 2L diesel.....needs rebuilding as its all in pieces right now. And its actually 2.4 Litres I believe, 2L is just the model of the engine. However, with the work it needs done, I was quoted $5600 to get it running again.:confused:

Or if you happen to luck out and find a wrecked right hand drive Toyota pickup that has a diesel engine, you might be able to put it in your truck. The newer engines (3L i believe) were more powerful and more reliable.

I only suggest Toyota as they have made a few small trucks with diesel engines.....turbo diesels as well.

If you're feeling ambitious, there is a machine shop in Edmonton that deals lots with import motors and the guy there might be able to help you out.

http://www.ecauto.ca/contact_us.htm

Guy that i talked to was Mike.

Good luck if you choose to go that route.
Wow $5600. I'll talk to the guy you posted, and call some shops in the states, see what they say.

Whats wrong with the engine? Hmm. not sure what I'd do for a transmission.

gophergunner
01-15-2009, 09:23 PM
Well I was quoted that price....in the end it might be more or less, but most likely more. I have since found and installed a 4.3 Chevy into my Toyota.

But of the 2 crankshafts I had for such a diesel engine, neither was good. One was repairable but the other was not. The head was in good shape, they are known for cracking. But this head was shipped off to Quebec to be welded up by the previous owner. And the cylinders weren't all straight to each other apparently. I'm not even sure if this engine has sleeves or not, but they told me that new cylinder liners would have to be pressed in and bored out to size for the pistons that were in the engine. Oddly enough, the pistons were some of the few pieces that were still in any good shape.

Aside from all the machining and labour, most of the parts were coming from Australia. That might add up pretty quickly.

I also could have sold you the 2wd Toyota diesel I had. It had the same 2L engine but it ran like it was new.

Here's a video of the truck. I ended up selling it for $3080. I'm kinda sorry right now, as I'll likely never see another truck like that in my posession.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-H_v8MLFjg

Gearstix
01-16-2009, 02:49 PM
Thats a neat truck..
I think I'll pass on that motor though bud. I'm probably just going to keep the gas 4 cylinder for a while, gunna see if something arises... I have been looking at tractor engines and stuff. I'm not sure how you'd mate a bobcat motor to a car trans. Plus I don't want a 50hp diesel.. I know there torquey but I dont wanna downgrade...

I'm not sure what sorta power you'd get outta a small 4cylinder diesel with a larger turbo and stuff...

I don't really want to rebuild a motor. I don't have the space, we were supposed to move to a large house but the deal fell through.

Gearstix
01-16-2009, 03:23 PM
http://dieselenginemotor.com/diesel/engines/252,1.html

Thats rather interesting...

http://www.dieselenginemotor.com/drawings/v3300-t-e%20Files/v3300sae

Hmm. I'm sure with a bit of tweaks I could get more power outta it, but it sees like it would fit.
I'd want to just get it in and running first before I start hopping it up.
Just how long would something like that last?

Gearstix
01-16-2009, 03:33 PM
Oh my guys, check this out!

https://www.dieselenginemotor.com/parts/index.php?action=view&id=974&parentid=974&itemno=235&subcatid=

"hese adapters let you adapt almost any Industrial engine with a #3, 4, or #5 SAE Bellhousing to most all Ford, Chevy, and Chrysler Manual or automatic transmissions.


Assembly instructions for the Transmission adapter.

This adapter consists of two cast parts that have been machined to the factory specifications for the transmission you are installing. This short instruction sheet should help you in your assembly of the product.

First, take the SAE adapter ring and install it on the back of your engine
SAE housing, with the flat surface facing you. Be sure that the top is at
the 12:00 position. Use Allen cap screws to fasten it to the housing, these should be 3/8 x 1 1/4" and torque to 44 foot lbs.


For Automatic transmissions
Place your flywheel adapter on a table and fit the Transmissions flex plate to the cast flywheel adapter, being sure that the flex plate is facing the proper way. Bolt it on using bolts that are at least 1 1/4" long and torque to 50 foot lbs.

Special Note: Make sure that all flat washers that come in contact with the
flex plate have the rounded surface against the flex plate. Failure to do
this will cause failure down the road and void all warranted on the unit.
Now install these two components to the torque converter, which is in the
transmission.

After you have installed the flywheel adapter to the transmission the hard
part is next. You lift the transmission up to the back of the engine and install to housing leaving the bolts loose to hold it on. Then, through the cut out on the bottom right side you will install the bolts through the flywheel adapter to the flywheel, using a socket and an extension. Leave them loose til you get all eight of them in, then you can go back and torque them to 32 foot lbs.


For manual transmission
Next install the flywheel adapter to the flywheel on the engine and torque the bolts to 32 foot lbs. Now bolt on the flywheel for the transmission you are going to use and torque these to 50 foot lbs. Then install your clutch, and finally install the transmission to the back of the housing adapter and bolt up.

"

WOW!
Maybe I could get one with the GM 4 cyl T-5 pattern on it... this may be more possible than I thought... :) If not its not hard to throw a GM automatic in my truck.

markelectric
01-24-2009, 06:52 AM
How about an older Ford escort with the Mazda 4cyl diesel and manual trans? I bought it a while back to swap the engine into a manlift. I have never had any time nor was I able to find an adapter for the pump to mount to it. The car was running fine when I got it. The body is a real rust heap shock towers completely gone. With a donor car as this you would get fuel filters heaters etc to make it easyier. I heard that some reefers ran this engine?

You can have it for just what I paid for it.

Let me know

Mark

Gearstix
05-25-2009, 09:21 PM
markelectric, do you still have it? What size engine is it?

I had a guy ask me if I ever did put in the 6.2, I said no, but I started looking around again on some classifieds. I've found Cats and John Deere engines for 4-5K, that are inline 4s, around 450-500lbs, and are around 40-50hp.
Would these engines be large enough? I guess I could always turbocharge them if they are not, and since most smaller engines are mechanical, I won't have to mess with computers.

How big of a radiator would I use for a small 4 cyl diesel? Would a 4.3 V6 radiator be sufficent? Maybe a corvette radiator? as they both fit.

I have found that adapter again from DieselEngineMotor, I emailed them to see if I could get an adapter to mate a SAE bolt pattern engine to my 4 cylinder T-5, no response. I may call them and ask. Would be alot easier if I could use my transmission. Its only good for 300hp, not sure how much torque.

markelectric
05-26-2009, 04:15 AM
I still have it. And the wife wants it gone. I think it is a 2.2 L. AS this is a whole car, you will get a radiator with it too. I gave $500 for it. I would be glad to help you load it onto your trailer. I think this is the same engine that was in the Ford ranger with the diesel option.

Let me know your thoughts.

Gearstix
05-26-2009, 02:52 PM
Would be a decent trip to come pick it up though. 3400kms. I'm in Alberta, Canada. Haha. I thought you just had the engine itself.

markelectric
05-26-2009, 05:18 PM
Thats only about 3 days each way.........

Gearstix
05-31-2009, 06:35 PM
I have found a guy in Edmonton, AB with two engines, 2.2L Nissan and 2.2L Mazda (the Mazda is really a Perkins)

I'm waiting back to see how many kms are on both.

Gearstix
06-01-2009, 02:26 PM
The nissan has 350000 but has had new rings and bottom end bearings. The mazda has about 500000km
Hmmmm...
Sorta high mileage innit?

markelectric
06-01-2009, 02:59 PM
The Mazda in the Escort only shows about 65000 mi as I remember it.......

Gearstix
03-06-2010, 07:15 PM
Holy crap this is a sticky? LOL.
Well I have another truck because my dad cut down a tree on the other one, the 94.

I now have a 1996 Chevy S10 with a blown 2.2 my dad bought to replace the one he crushed.

I still want to do a diesel, and do a waste vegetable oil conversion.

I've found a Perkins T4.236 at my dads work, but it was ran out of oil (still runs but has top end noise) and my dad also knows for an Isuzu diesel that runs, although we don't know any details on it.

I've also found a Mazda built Perkins from a Mazda B2200/Ford Ranger. Guy wants $850 for it and it comes with tranny, 226K. I don't feel that it is worth it and its in Manitoba, and I'm in Alberta..

One problem is, I have to have an automatic.

I have a 4.3 V6 4L60E, I've found a manual shift kit that does not require a computer however it comes with a vaccuum module to controll the line pressure and as far as I know, this won't work on a diesel....
I would like to be able to use the trans I got.

GregCrabb
04-05-2010, 10:48 PM
I saw on ebay a few years ago, someone had a GMC Sonoma with a Mercedes turbo 5 cylinder in it...looked awesome and got great mileage too. I know a man here in Tennessee who stuck a Mercedes turbo 6 cylinder in a Suburban with the GM automatic transmission and it sold on ebay as well. I got his email address and talked with him about a project like this I want to do as well. I found a website who sells conversion kits for Mercedes engines to mate with other mfg. trannys but It's on my computer at home and I'm at work right now.