P0087 fuel rail pressure low limp under high loads

[Demilee]

I doubt going to a GM or any other dealership is going to help, like Jessica from GM suggests. No offense. I have to say I've had 2 Chevy dealerships tell me to get new injectors. HOWEVER, two other Chevy dealerships say no and so did 3 separate diesel engine techs who own their own business. Can't leave it up to a huge corporation to solve an issue on trucks that are all past their warranty date. If that were true we wouldn't be posting here right now about this issue... Like another poster said this is one of the most checked threads on the forum.

Anyway, I apologize to everyone that I never posted back about our truck issues. No they are still not resolved. I tried cleaning off the fuel cooler. Still not sure about how to disconnect a fuel heater like DmaxMaverick suggests. I personally would need some more detailed steps on how to do that.

Jeff, you said

Waiting until Monday for them to resume but I am pushing the collapsed fuel line angle, and once they fix that and/or whatever else they come up with, I will be heading to a car wash to do the fuel cooler clean you all recommend, and trying again.

I'd do the collapsed fuel line repair anyway but don't hold your breath on that working long term. It's still a good idea. I think the whole repair for that only cost us about $100.

I'm actually thinking of getting suped up fuel cooler after all the symptoms we've had. Anyone think that this sounds like a good idea to try out? Someone on this forum that works on diesels named "DieselTech" seems to have the answer. ---> Add another fuel lift and another fuel cooler.
http://www.dmaxcentral.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5358

At this point we are just dealing with the problem. We baby our truck when towing, never use the cruise, make use of the down hills to get up the next hill and clear codes as needed. We plan to drive a good 3-4 hours when starting out on any extended trip and then we stop off for breakfast or lunch somewhere (and we are VERY leisurely about it) to get the truck to cool down as much as possible. This seems to help a lot so far. We also get fuel just before leaving instead of getting it the night before. Maybe this is helping with the fuel temps?

Jeff please let us know if anything works for you.

-Demi

2008 Silverado - 3500 HD DRW (198k miles - symptoms since ~115k - purchased at 105k)
*We've had the GM bulletin PIP4526 collapsing fuel line issue addressed already
*Already tried washing off fuel cooler
*Towing a 2012 Dutchman Voltage 3900 (7.25 tons dry)

[DmaxMaverick]

To keep it simple:

There are 2 wire harness sets to the filter assembly. The lower is the WIF (Water In Fuel) sensor, and the upper is the fuel heater. Follow the upper wires from the filter assy to the connector. Disconnect the connector if you want/need to disconnect the heater. The PCM controls the heater, but doesn't monitor it. The PCM only sends voltage to the heater, but doesn't monitor feedback, so if it isn't connected/working, it won't know (or care).

[Demilee]

To keep it simple:

There are 2 wire harness sets to the filter assembly. The lower is the WIF (Water In Fuel) sensor, and the upper is the fuel heater. Follow the upper wires from the filter assy to the connector. Disconnect the connector if you want/need to disconnect the heater. The PCM controls the heater, but doesn't monitor it. The PCM only sends voltage to the heater, but doesn't monitor feedback, so if it isn't connected/working, it won't know (or care).

Great! I know exactly which one you mean now. Thanks!

-Demi

[Jeff Paxton]

Just got the call from the repair shop. They said, "We did an injector balance test and the numbers are all over the place indicating you need injectors." Of course, not being a diesel tech, I can't make sense of this. All I can do is look at obvious symptoms that present when injectors are bad. I don't remember all of them at the moment, but It starts easily, idles like a purring kitten, doesn't smoke, and has power out the wazoo when not hooked up to a load. Thoughts anyone? Will this cause a starvation for fuel under load when downshifting up a hill? I am still leaning toward fuel lines as a logical reason. But when they call me with a parts quote, I want to either tell them do the fuel lines, or just tell them I'm coming to get it because I am not doing injectors regardless. The truck isn't worth that kind of expense.

Edit to add: he said "the balance rates are ranging from -.4 to 1.7 or 9 or something..." From what I am reading, anything inside of +/-4 is acceptable so...?

Just got off the phone again with the quote. $7k+ for new fuel rails and injectors. I said I am not throwing more good money after bad and I will be picking it up to limp it home. I asked specifically what the values were on the balance test... Now he said -.8 to 1.5. I didn't argue that this acceptable, what's the point? They don't want to mess with the fuel line collapse. I may pursue it a little more once I get home, with my dealership, but I will let you all know the outcome. I may just sell the whole rig and forget it.

[More Power]

Question to JK....

Why is the LBZ and LMM more likely to produce a P0087 than an LB7 or LLY (at least that seems to be the case...)?

Jim

[Demilee]

Just got the call from the repair shop. They said, "We did an injector balance test and the numbers are all over the place indicating you need injectors." Of course, not being a diesel tech, I can't make sense of this. All I can do is look at obvious symptoms that present when injectors are bad. I don't remember all of them at the moment, but It starts easily, idles like a purring kitten, doesn't smoke, and has power out the wazoo when not hooked up to a load. Thoughts anyone? Will this cause a starvation for fuel under load when downshifting up a hill? I am still leaning toward fuel lines as a logical reason. But when they call me with a parts quote, I want to either tell them do the fuel lines, or just tell them I'm coming to get it because I am not doing injectors regardless. The truck isn't worth that kind of expense.

Edit to add: he said "the balance rates are ranging from -.4 to 1.7 or 9 or something..." From what I am reading, anything inside of +/-4 is acceptable so...?

Just got off the phone again with the quote. $7k+ for new fuel rails and injectors. I said I am not throwing more good money after bad and I will be picking it up to limp it home. I asked specifically what the values were on the balance test... Now he said -.8 to 1.5. I didn't argue that this acceptable, what's the point? They don't want to mess with the fuel line collapse. I may pursue it a little more once I get home, with my dealership, but I will let you all know the outcome. I may just sell the whole rig and forget it.

Yea, I believe it was Mark Rinkler from this thread that got all new injectors and it didn't help at all.

[Demilee]

I asked this before in another post. I'm actually thinking of getting souped up fuel cooler after all the symptoms we've had. Anyone think that this sounds like a good idea to try out?

Someone on this forum that works on diesels named "DieselTech" seems to have the answer. ---> Add another fuel lift and another fuel cooler.
http://www.dmaxcentral.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5358

Anyone have thoughts/opinions on this?

[More Power]

Yea, I believe it was Mark Rinkler from this thread that got all new injectors and it didn't help at all.

It's my understanding that new injectors almost always solve the problem - once the other more routine possibilities have been eliminated.

Another-larger fuel cooler could work, as does an auxiliary fuel tank. In either case, it's a bandaid that might allow a set of injectors to reach design life.

I wonder if B5 or B20 bio-diesel helps or hurts in these situations because of how fuel viscosity is affected.

Jim

[Jeff Paxton]

Well, thought we were in the good after making council bluffs/Omaha. Got a limp between Omaha and Lincoln. Just got another and we are barely out of Lincoln. After stopping to eat, came out to a pretty good wind. It's a head wind and it's killing me

[CoyleJR]

Jim,
That is a very good thought about bio-diesel. I stopped using it years ago when I realized that it hurt my fuel mileage and it cost more than regular diesel. I also have an auxiliary tank that keeps my primary tank full at all times. My 190k mile, LBZ truck has never shown a P0087 code. Friday will be a test, the temperature is predicted to be 120 and I will be going east over the mountains from Phoenix Az. The total weight will be near 24k lbs and if the truck doesn't show P0087 code it never will.
John

[Mark Rinker]

Yea, I believe it was Mark Rinkler from this thread that got all new injectors and it didn't help at all.

Hello all. For clarification, I never replaced the injectors on my 2009 K3500, the last Duramax I sold with the sale of my business. I included the Diablosport Predator LBZ/LMM handheld programmer (with code reset capability) with the truck and told the new owner all about the P00087 situation.

I had the same issues with the 2006 truck that preceded the 2009...becoming more frequent as the trucks neared 100K miles in service.



Good luck with your work-arounds.

[Jeff Paxton]

Update: Per GM customer care request, took the diesel tech for a ride-a-long today towing the camper to try and trigger limp mode while he had his computer plugged in. Was fortunate to get it to limp twice. The temp was 88 degrees. He was frantically writing down info most of the time. So now I will wait to see what they come up with after they hash it out. Will keep you all posted.