Newbie With a 1983 G Series Van & 6.2

[Bigshankhank]

Allow to propose a lazy question;
Given the engine placement within the doghouse tunnel on my van, getting to the glow plugs on the front four cylinders (2 right side and 2 left) is a bit of chore, having to work in the blind. Do all eight GPs need to be removed in order to test for fuel spray? If so, then so be it.

[DmaxMaverick]

That's concerning. If it continued to run with the power taken away, the pump definitely needs attention. Not necessarily an overhaul or replacement, but a Stanadyne tech needs to have a look at it. A bench test would confirm it's condition. A simple ESS repair will be inexpensive, if that's all it is. A quick Google search shows the nearest Stanadyne certified shop is Pinellas Diesel Service in Clearwater. They appear to be capable. Give them a call.

[Bigshankhank]

Cool, thank you. I pulled the four GPs and got a blast of air but no fuel, even with my finger in front of the hole it came back dry after several rotations, I'll see if that shop can check my pump over the weekend.
Thanks again.

[Dvldog8793]

If no fuel spray on 4 cylinders, you are not getting fuel to the injectors.
I would expect it is the ESS or the wire to it. Both of those can be verified without taking the pump out. It could just be a pinched wire. I have never had to replace the ESS but it shouldn't be to hard, I know all the pumps in my local salvage yard have the top cover gone and ESS missing. So it would seem that a shade tree can do it.
If you had the truck running and then it failed due to nasty fuel it might be possible that the fuel did something to the ESS.
In any case, I would verify the ESS and research replacing it before you pull the pump.
Good Luck!

[Bigshankhank]

If no fuel spray on 4 cylinders, you are not getting fuel to the injectors.
I would expect it is the ESS or the wire to it. Both of those can be verified without taking the pump out. It could just be a pinched wire. I have never had to replace the ESS but it shouldn't be to hard, I know all the pumps in my local salvage yard have the top cover gone and ESS missing. So it would seem that a shade tree can do it.
If you had the truck running and then it failed due to nasty fuel it might be possible that the fuel did something to the ESS.
In any case, I would verify the ESS and research replacing it before you pull the pump.
Good Luck!

I am getting voltage to the ESS, and the solenoid clicks (faintly but I can hear it and feel a bump with my finger on it) when I remove and replace the pink wire.

Sadly yesterday I received the dreaded "Get your RV out of your driveway" notice from my HOA, so now I am in crisis mode. I am going double check the tightness of both of my new fuel filters and bleed air out of the injectors one more time then pull the GPs and check for fuel mist with a clean paper towel before I commit to removing the IP. I just need to limp it over to the storage lot two miles away.

[Dvldog8793]

If you are getting air in the system, it is BEFORE the lift pump. Sometimes you can identify this by a line that get wet when not cranking but not actively leaking. Cant remember if you replaced any in tank parts. Are you using an outside fuel source(the boat tank)? It could be possible that you are sucking air from inside the tank.
MOST of the time, you will be safe checking for fuel at 3-4 cylinders, the odds of more than a couple injectors NOT working at all is pretty slim, especially since you did have it running at some point.
Sounds like your ESS is working. Like DMAX said, the injector pump needs to be pushing fuel at a very high pressure. So even if you have fuel at the injector line fittings, it may not be popping the injectors. Especially if the injectors are a little tight and sticky.
If you pull the pump this weekend, follow the instructions in the book step by step. In a van it will be a pain because access to the front and the pump lines is tight.
Again....Good luck!

[Bigshankhank]

If you are getting air in the system, it is BEFORE the lift pump. Sometimes you can identify this by a line that get wet when not cranking but not actively leaking. Cant remember if you replaced any in tank parts. Are you using an outside fuel source(the boat tank)? It could be possible that you are sucking air from inside the tank.
MOST of the time, you will be safe checking for fuel at 3-4 cylinders, the odds of more than a couple injectors NOT working at all is pretty slim, especially since you did have it running at some point.
Sounds like your ESS is working. Like DMAX said, the injector pump needs to be pushing fuel at a very high pressure. So even if you have fuel at the injector line fittings, it may not be popping the injectors. Especially if the injectors are a little tight and sticky.

I am still using the van's tank, so if its leaking between there and the primary filter up to the lift pump at least I know where all the fittings are.
I have not dropped the main tank to get to any of it's parts as it is full of fuel. I have been hoping to just run the fuel level down and drop it once it is near to empty so I can fix the sending unit and replace the sock, but you know it has to actually run in order to do that. I do not have enough containers to siphon nearly 40 gallons out of it.
I did check the fuel lines and filters after I replaced them and had the engine running and did not notice any weeping or wet spots, but I will roll up underneath again this evening and see if I can spot anything. There are no drops on the driveway, FWIW.

If you pull the pump this weekend, follow the instructions in the book step by step. In a van it will be a pain because access to the front and the pump lines is tight.
Again....Good luck!

Man you don't even know. I have read the steps in the book a couple of times through and really want to try and get it out tonight so I can get it to the shop in the morning and maybe get it back and reinstalled this weekend. if I had a helper who could do the work from inside while I work from outside it would be nice, but noone I know knows a darn thing about wrenching. It being Mother's day means I don't even have Sunday to work on it which sucks.

[Bigshankhank]

Only confusing part of removing the IP, how do I place a timing mark on the pump prior to removal? Assuming I do not need to replace it with new, is there a pulley on the face of it with a timing mark somewhere? I can just mark the body to match that so when I get it back it should align close enough to get down the road, correct? Once I pull it off, I won't rotate the engine any further so I am not too terribly concerned with lining up the engine timing marks in any orientation, just resetting the IP position to match it when it was removed.

Thanks again for the help.

[DmaxMaverick]

The pump timing, initially, should be a walk in the park. It should already have timing marks on the pump mounting flange top, and on the timing cover top. The marks should line up, or be close (if timing has been adjusted, which is normal for higher mileage engines to compensate for timing parts wear). If you don't find timing marks on both, scribe a mark on the pump flange that lines up with the mark on the timing cover. If you find marks and they are more than 1/8" apart, make a scribe mark on the IP flange that lines up with the mark on the timing cover. If you install a different pump, it should have a timing mark you can line up with the mark on the timing cover (line it up approximate to the current pump timing marks). Timing may not be ideal, but it's close enough for a start and run. Correct on not turning the engine with the IP removed. It won't mess with the pump timing, but the pump drive gear can become off-timed with the cam gear (it just sits on top of the cam gear with no pump installed). When installing, the indexing pin on the pump drive flange will reset the correct timing (it will only install correctly one way. so make SURE the pin lines up with the hole in the gear). If for any reason the gear timing seem off, confirm it by lining up the gear timing marks. It's a good idea to rotate the engine so the marks can be seen (through the oil fill hole) lined up, before removing the pump. I've never had one move on me, but it can happen.

If you make timing adjustments, remember, the pump rotates opposite the crank, and at 1/2 speed of the crank (IP timing degrees will be exaggerated at 2X that of the crank, so it doesn't take much movement to mean a lot).

[Bigshankhank]

The pump timing, initially, should be a walk in the park. It should already have timing marks on the pump mounting flange top, and on the timing cover top. The marks should line up, or be close (if timing has been adjusted, which is normal for higher mileage engines to compensate for timing parts wear). If you don't find timing marks on both, scribe a mark on the pump flange that lines up with the mark on the timing cover. If you find marks and they are more than 1/8" apart, make a scribe mark on the IP flange that lines up with the mark on the timing cover. If you install a different pump, it should have a timing mark you can line up with the mark on the timing cover (line it up approximate to the current pump timing marks). Timing may not be ideal, but it's close enough for a start and run. Correct on not turning the engine with the IP removed. It won't mess with the pump timing, but the pump drive gear can become off-timed with the cam gear (it just sits on top of the cam gear with no pump installed). When installing, the indexing pin on the pump drive flange will reset the correct timing (it will only install correctly one way. so make SURE the pin lines up with the hole in the gear). If for any reason the gear timing seem off, confirm it by lining up the gear timing marks. It's a good idea to rotate the engine so the marks can be seen (through the oil fill hole) lined up, before removing the pump. I've never had one move on me, but it can happen.

If you make timing adjustments, remember, the pump rotates opposite the crank, and at 1/2 speed of the crank (IP timing degrees will be exaggerated at 2X that of the crank, so it doesn't take much movement to mean a lot).

Got it, I am not intending to change or adjust timing at this point, I would hope with only 62K miles this engine isn't "worn" enough to necessitate adjustment yet.

From reading the book, isn't it necessary to rotate the crank in order to access the mounting bolts for the pump? I don't have the book in front of me right now, but I understand removing the oil fill tube from the plate is necessary to access those bolts, and rotating the crank allows access to all three of them.

[DmaxMaverick]

Yes. You will need to rotate the engine to access all the bolts. I was referring to rotation once the pump is removed. If you line up the timing marks on the gears once all the bolts are removed, it will be more simple to line up the pilot/index pin during reinstall. It isn't complicated, and there's no reason to complicate it.

[Bigshankhank]

OK, just wanted to make sure I understood what you were saying.

edit: Called that shop and they are closed on the weekend, did you just google Stanadyne repair shops or how did you find them?

edit #2: Nevermind, I searched both Google and Stanadyne's homepage and that is the nearest shop to me. Monday it shall be, and hopefully it will be a simple fix that I can get it moving by Tuesday.

[DmaxMaverick]

Google search for Sarasota and Stanadyne, and Stanadyne's page. Good luck with your HOA!

[Dvldog8793]

FYI-
When you are removing the injection pump bolts, Put a shop rag in the bottom of the hole to prevent any stuff, like the bolt, from dropping into the cover. I also put a dab of heavy grease on the socket to make sure the bolt doesn't drop out of the socket.
If you remove as many glow plugs as you can, turning the engine will be MUCH easier. It will be VERY helpful to have at least some extra eyes to watch for the bolt to come into view while you are turn the engine.
Have good weekend!

[Bigshankhank]

Got it, thanks. Sadly this is a solo effort.

[Bigshankhank]

Oh my, I may have found my problem. I hope and pray that I found my problem. Will report back in the AM.

[Bigshankhank]

Possible air leak at the secondary filter. Fixed, re-bled all eight injectors. Now it will start and blow a ton of white smoke, then will stall.
Dies almost immediately upon startup, I can get to about 1/2 throttle and it will hang in for a second or two longer then it stalls.
Quick help anyone who is out there.

[DmaxMaverick]

Keep looking for leaks. Test for air in the system. You should have the clear line installed on the fuel return outlet until this is completely behind you. As long as air is getting into the system, starting attempts will result the same (fruitless).

[Bigshankhank]

Keep looking for leaks. Test for air in the system. You should have the clear line installed on the fuel return outlet until this is completely behind you. As long as air is getting into the system, starting attempts will result the same (fruitless).

So are you saying it sounds like air rather than the IP? Cause I am sure you can tell that I really do not want to remove the IP if I don't have to.

[DmaxMaverick]

It could be the IP, but I don't know. It could be air, which hasn't been eliminated. Eliminating the IP would be simple: Just replace it (and you may still have a problem with air). Eliminating an air leak requires a process, but a lot less expensive than replacing the IP. If you have a leak, and replace the IP, you still have to fix the leak.

What I would do, knowing what I know about your truck at this time:
Plug in the block heater.
Connect a battery charger (charge, not trickle).
Install a clear line loop at the fuel return outlet at the pump.
Verify the HPCA is getting power on a cold start with key ON. It's the other wire connected to the IP (not on the throttle, if it has a TPS).
Come back after 2-4 hours after connecting charger and block heater.
Injector lines tight, and everything ready for a "normal" start. Crank engine in 15 second intervals (with 5 minutes rest). Watch the fuel return clear line loop. The fuel should push out any air, and you should not see more bubbles. If more bubbles, back to step 1: find/fix the leak.

It started and ran before, which means the IP and injectors are, at least, minimally functional. Something caused the fuel volume to diminish or stop enough to not continue running.