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View Full Version : 1000 mile tow with Juice



Dave
07-09-2002, 22:40
Memorial Day week I took a trip from Ten Mile, TN to Charleston, SC and back. My truck was 100% stock, and my combination weight was 20,235. I followed I-40 east from Kinston TN to the junction with I-26 east in Asheville, NC. I then followed I-26 east to Charleston, SC. Much of this 1000-mile round trip was in the foothills of the Smoky Mountains and across them.
Through I-40 the truck would frequently down shift to 4th, especially in the Smoky Mountains. Nowhere on I-40 could I use cruise. Two hills dropped the truck to 3rd. On I-26 it was the same until I got east of Columbia, I could then use cruise and stay in 5th. The trip back was the same. Heading west up Saluida on I-26, 7% grade for about 3 miles, the truck and trailer was at 55~56mph in 3rd gear at 3100RPM. The clutch fan was engaged the whole trip up the grade and out side temp was 86 degrees.
The week of the 4th of July I took the same trip. This time I had the Power Edge Juice box and was at a combination weight of 20,450. The box was set to level 2 in the tow mode. I could use cruise on I-40 east until 30 miles or so east of Knoxville. The truck stayed in 5th. I did not use cruise though the Smoky Mountains, but the truck again stayed in 5th except when the Allison down shifted to slow me on the downhill. In fact the whole trip east on I-40 and I-26 the truck never downshifted from 5th to climb a hill. I was able to pull every hill at or above the posted speed limit in 5th. It did require a little care with the go pedal in a couple places to keep EGT below 1250.
The trip back west was much the same. Headed west I climbed Saluida in 4th gear at 59~60 mph and 2300 rpm. The temperature out side was 94 and the clutch fan run off and on. I did have to watch EGT on the climb. I never let it get above 1250, and boost was at 23 to 25 psi. I do believe if I pushed the truck as hard as I did with out the box I could have climbed it much faster.
Things I learned from these two trips. Weights were close, as were temps. However with the box the load was just over 200 pounds heavier and it was 8 degrees hotter. The Juice box is a big improvement. With the box the truck will upshift to 5th at 58~60mph in the tow mode where as stock it was 65~67 mph. Basically what required a down shift to 4th now is pulled in 5th and what use to require 3rd can now be pulled in 4th. Cruise can now be used where it could not be used. Fuel mileage is about the same or .5 mpg better with the box. I averaged 11mpg with out it in May and in July I averaged 11.5 mpg. The truck did not feel like it was working as hard and accelerated better with a load. The clutch fan was engaged less. Engine and transmission temperatures are the same with or with out the box.
I also learned I would not tow heavy with out an EGT gage with or with out the box! I say this because from the amount of time the clutch fan runs with out the box the truck must go over 1250 EGT stock. I never exceeded 1250 EGT with the box and the clutch fan ran less and the out side temp was hotter.
With the box you can exceed 1250 EGT. With very slight pedal modulation you can keep it at or below 1250 EGT. I do not believe it is safe to run above that temp for long. GM may feel different, I was tempted to climb Saluida again with out the box to measure the EGT which I am fairly confident would have been over 1300 or more.
The Juice box, Amsoil air filter and ISSPRO EV series gages are the only performance modifications to my truck. Would a better air intake and bigger exhaust help with EGT

motovet
07-10-2002, 00:55
Dave, I too pulled a long trip recently with the Juice. As I have already noted from other short trips I have taken, the added performance is substancial.Much less downshifting, better acceleration, slightly better MPG. Prior to the last trip I did add a 4" Banks system wich lowered my EGT's aproximately 100* and added about 2# of boost. Prior to the exhaust my top boost reading was 22#, and now I reach 24#. With the 4" exhaust the EGT's still climb fast but you can abuse the peddle more before you reach 1250. Something I realized on this last trip is that with the added performance the truck will hold overdrive sometimes to long. I never thought I would say that, but on some long grades the truck will just keep pulling in OD untill the temp reaches the danger zone. Then to get it to shift to 4th to get some more air you have to mash the peddle to the floor. What I really want and we ALL SHOULD HAVE is a 5 speed selector. The Banks did seem to add some acceleration, but overall power seems about the same.

IndigoDually
07-10-2002, 05:14
My motorhome is built on a Workhorse chasis with an 8.1/Allison. It is always in tow/haul(there is no selector) but, it does have an OD ON/OFF switch. This tells me that some legwork with a willing Allison dealer, there is a way to add a switch to shut off 5th gear. This sounds like the solution to rising EGT's without having to floor it to downshift.

If anyone out there is buddies with a dealer I think that it is probably an easy modification. I will try to trace the wires on mine but I believe that the wiring harness is so much different that there would not be too many similarities to our trucks.

John

MABurns
07-10-2002, 10:25
Great report Dave, best auguement I have seen yet for the merits of a box other than to race around real fast.

I might just have to take the plunge!

Tinbender
07-10-2002, 11:12
Best report I've seen so far regarding towing and the Juice, I guess I'm going to have to consider adding it to my truck. Said I was going to leave this one stock, as I only use it for receational towing, but you've just about convienced me. Thanks for the report

Bob

SoCalDMAX
07-10-2002, 11:36
Excellent posts on your findings! I can only imagine what those grades must be like, as long and steep as they are. Can you imagine others traveling in those mountains overloaded, with a lot less powerful truck and no tow/haul? Probably straining to go 30mph uphill and a white-knuckle downhill banzai at 80mph! I'm sweating just thinking about it!

The really great thing about diesels is the nature of the beast. Any other engine that you could modify for that much extra power would get you a gas guzzling, undriveable nightmare. After buying the Juice (or other mod) it's all "free" power, same mileage, possibly better if staying in a higher gear.

OD lockout: This capability was added recently with a TCM reflash. Info on how to actually hook it up is avail. on the 2500/3500 drivetrain forum. Search for OD lockout.

Regards, Steve

motovet
07-10-2002, 17:39
Well I searched the drivetrain forum and all I could find was some old posts of people wanting to lock out overdrive to stop the old problem of the busy 4th-5th shifting with the stock power. Who would have guessed back then there would be enough power available to hold 5th to much? Could not find any posts with a solution. Does anyone know of one?

SoCalDMAX
07-10-2002, 18:37
Here's the post from 77transam discussing how to install the OD lockout.

http://forum.62-65-dieselpage.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=003361&p=2

Regards, Steve

Dave
07-10-2002, 22:54
Motovet, I agree it can stay in 5th to long with the juice. If the RPM get much below 1700 the temps start climbing. I had it down to about 53 and around 14~1500 rpm, it would run the egt up quick there. It did have the power even in 5th down that low to pull it back up to 65.

I did find a little extra pressure on the go pedal and you can still force the down shift. I did also find towing with the juice is more pleasureable than towing with out it. Cruise is now a usefull option on my truck when towing!

Dave
07-12-2002, 22:10
Motovet,

What are your thoughts on the 4" banks exhaust? How long have you had it? Was it hard to install? Is it louder in the truck? How big a help with EGT? Please elaborate on it and give as much info as you can. You have uped my curiosity on it. Thanks

motovet
07-13-2002, 00:48
Dave, I have only had the exhaust on for a few weeks, but during that time I did take a towing trip to the Reno- Taho area, so I've had a few miles on it. First off it looks real good... big ol' 5" out the back.(I will add pics soon) The install I had done by a local exhaust shop wich cost 40$ and took him all of 20 min. I had it welded instead of clamped, this was especially important for the tip because the clamp they provide is UUGGGLY! There is no real increase in noise level at idle or when cruising with light throttle. There is a noticeable increase when accelerating throughtout the entire RPM range, though I found it quite tolerable. You can still hear the turbo just fine, and it does not hinder conversation or bother the family. There is also no resonence in the cab at any particular RPM. The only times the system sounds a bit loud is when you are next to a concrete divider or truck or something. This tells me that at least others are enjoying the cool rumble. I have noticed about a 100* decrease in the EGT. This is especially helpful on those long grades because you can abuse the throttle more before you reach 1250,though you will still get there. I have gained 2# of boost going from 22# to 24#. The performance gains seem to be limited to quicker acceleration. Before the exhaust the truck was plenty powerful with the Juice, but there was a slight hesitation prior to the turbo boost. That hesitation is gone so all thats left is pure performance. For the money the gains the Juice give can't be beat, but the Banks system is a fine compliment to the package.

motovet
07-13-2002, 00:56
Steve, Thanks for the link. But it doesn't work for me for some reason?

JEBar
07-13-2002, 04:50
Dave...having grown up in the Asheville area I can attest to all persons reading you initial post that your truck's performance on Saluida and the other grades throughout that area is impressive .... no, very impressive .... drove mine through there last Easter but was running solo and in a stock truck ... really enjoyed your post :cool:

TLA
07-13-2002, 07:41
motovet - look under 2500/3500 drivetrain. Go back to the 3rd page, and look for New Calibration and "Trussman's Syndrome". Near the bottom is some information that will help you.

motovet
07-13-2002, 10:35
Thanks

Dave
07-13-2002, 21:12
Thank you for the good responce Motovet! I do agree, plenty of power with the juice. Banks exhaust sounds like it may be a nice addition.