View Full Version : Exhaust Downpipe Installation - 4" inch Jerry Jardine System
Jochen Woern
10-24-2007, 06:06
Getting ready to install my new 4" inch Jerry Jardine, Pinnacle Power Exhaust System on my '96 Burb.
I checked the underneith of the truck out yesterday and am thinking that the installation of the new system should be fairly easy, with exception of the connection of the downpipe to the turbo.
I thought there would be three (3) bolts on the back of the turbo, similar to the mounting of the cross overpipe. Looks like there is a ring/ring clamp instead that connects the downpipe to the back of the turbo.
- Is this pretty easy to install?
- Jardine says to disassemble the air box for easier access, I have a performance intake kit installed and it looks as if there was enough room?
- I think I read here before someone suggesting to remove the complete passenger side fenderwell for easier access in order to tighten on the turbo.
- Does anyone have any photos how the downpipe exactly connects to the turbo?
ANY INPUT you guys can provide, ANY HINTS and/or TIPS to make the install any easier would be very much appreciated.
THANKS in advance.
DennisG01
10-24-2007, 06:20
You don't need to remove the wheel well. The downpipe and turbo simply get squeezed together by that clamp (which may feel stuck, but it can come completely off). A while back there was a thread I was involved with that talked about all this and more. Do a search and you'll find a lot of info about this subject.
DA BIG ONE
10-24-2007, 13:22
Just pull airbox for easy access to vee-band clamp unscrew it until pipe releases.
Just did a 4" Heath on mine. Why anyone would not want to spend the extra 20 mins to half an hour to remove the passanger side inner wing for access for stuff like this I'll never know each to his own I guess. I removed mine and whilst I was in there I also replaced glowplugs, rotten glowplug shields and cleaned up the ground strap connections found on this side. If not replacing glowplugs it is still a good time to clean up their connections mine were fairly corroded.
Cannot speak for the Jardine but the Heath downpipe makes #6 glowplug unaccessable once installed.
If you leave the inner wing in then as already mentioned at least pull the air cleaner box.
Think of it this way, if you pull the inner wing to make life a little easier then you also get to anti-sieze all fasteners making it removable without cursing 4 years from now when you really do need to get in there. I am planning on pulling the driver side inner wing next week to do this as a matter of course for future maintenance needs.
cheers
Nobby
I replaced my injectors earlier this summer and had to remove the turbo. All i did to remove the downpipe from the turbo was get in there with a 1/4" drive and some extensions and it came out in very little time. I never removed the air box or the fender wing. It will definitely make things easier to remove the air box, but I wouldn't remove any fender things, its unnecessary. But, I didn't have any problems taking the v-clamp and downpipe on or off with both the air box and wing in place.
sturgeon-phish
10-25-2007, 07:21
Removal is easy, back off the clamp till you can open it and remove the old crinkle pipe.
Before you install the new down pipe, take an hammer and bend the floorboard flange down flat. This gives about another 1/2" of room and removes a possible point of contact that would later drive you crazy.
IT is easier if you have someone under and one on topside to hold the pipe against the turbo but it can be done alone. Rig some temporary supports with hanger wire holding the down pipe as close as possible. On topside open the clamp up a bit and back the bolt almost off the screw. Reach down and pull the down pipe next to the turbo and put the clamp around the turbo / pipe flange, and snap the end over the end of the bolt. Slowly tighten the bolt ensuring you caught the pipe to the turbo flange. once it is tight enough where it will not drop out but still able to move go underneath and place the pipe with as much clearance as possible. You will now see why you bent the floorboard seam down now. When it is where you like it, tighten up the band clamp.
As for the rest of the exhaust, hang it loose adjust it and tighten it into place. I spent twice as much time adjusting for clearance than I did getting it under the truck.
Jim
Jochen Woern
10-26-2007, 05:57
As always, EXCELLENT feedback!!!!!!!
Thank you all VERY much, I shall tackle this project this weekend.
Jochen Woern
10-27-2007, 22:49
Thanks to all of you, the exhaust went on this afternoon without any issues, had someone help me up top and the allignment of the downpipe to the back of the turbo with the V-Clamp connection was a breeze. It was not necessary to remove my aFe Stage 2 Air Intake Kit nor would I recommend to take the fender well out. If you have the proper tools available, the removal of air intake or fender well would be completely unnecessary.
DA BIG ONE
10-28-2007, 00:45
I see your sig showing 4" turbo back exhaust system meaning the down pipe is 4" too, or?
Jochen Woern
10-28-2007, 10:06
Hello DA BIG ONE, how are you?
Nope, Jerry Jardine calls their system a 4" inch Turbo back system, but the down pipe I believe is 3 1/2" inches and then converts into 4" inches.
Boy, it sure put a lot of grunt to her, I am wondering if it will improve the gas (well, diesel) mileage as well?
Hope this clarifies your question.
have a great Sunday.
Mark Rinker
10-28-2007, 18:20
I really liked the sound of the Jardine system on my '94 K3500 reg cab shorty flatbed. That with the Turbo-Master turned up it whistled and had a throaty rumble that I miss.
However, I don't miss the wrenching that I was doing on those well-thrashed beasts, as they approached 200K miles. They had led a very very rough life - first as municipal plow / city trucks, then plow / tow vehicles for my company.
R.I.P. :D 'White' and 'Orange' as they were affectionately known to my crew. ('White' broke a crankshaft last fall and is likely parted out and crushed by now. 'Orange' got a '98 engine after also breaking a crankshaft at 123K, and now has a new California owner, so lets hope she is leading a life of sunny retirement. He called last week inquiring about the mirrors, so she must still be running!!!)
Hello DA BIG ONE, how are you?
Nope, Jerry Jardine calls their system a 4" inch Turbo back system, but the down pipe I believe is 3 1/2" inches and then converts into 4" inches.
Boy, it sure put a lot of grunt to her, I am wondering if it will improve the gas (well, diesel) mileage as well?
Hope this clarifies your question.
have a great Sunday.
Will be very curious with your mileage gains, I have been procrastinating with the exhaust upgrade for way too long. Maybe a little positive results from you may get me fired up again!
Glad every thing went smoothly on the install. Dave
had someone help me up top and the allignment of the downpipe to the back of the turbo with the V-Clamp connection was a breeze.
I just tried to install my pinnacle exhaust last night at 5 pm and by 1 am still hadn't finished. I could not get the v-clamp around the downpipe flange to tighten the v-clamp. Finally I pulled the downpipe out and compared the flange to my old downpipe and the new flange is like 3/8"-1/2" larger! Tonight I am going to carefully grind down the circumference of the flange to the same size of the original downpipe. Both pipes are 3" it's just the new flange is larger. I finally loosely hung the rest of the exhaust as best as I could and now I can finally hang the downpipe when I grind the flange down.
Has anyone else had any problems with pinnacle exhaust? Or am I the first one?
Jochen Woern
10-30-2007, 21:29
Good evening Kenneth,
Sorry to hear about your problems.
My Pinnacle Exhaust installed with no issues. But again, I had a friend help me allign it around the Turbo Flange/V-Clamp, but it was not really an issue. I was underneath the truck, my buddy on the top. He completely removed the V-Clamp as I moved the flange of the downpipe upwards towards the turbo. Once it was up there, he pushed the clamp around both flanges, adjusted accordingly and tightend it up. We then moved on and got the remaining pieces installed, alligned everything correctly until we finally thightend everything from front to back.
I would say that the hangers could probably fit a little better, some of them are not exactly straight, but they do connect to the Rubber hangers and the exhaust is hanging solid on the frame.
I have heard before that some people had allignment problems with the Pinnacle Exhaust, but suppossedly Pinnacle took care of the problem right away and send the proper pieces in order to make the proper fit.
Did you call their 800 number????? They do answer and have good service. If your flange is really to big, I would call them first before grinding on it. Once you grind, I would assume that the warranty is off and they will no longer replace the part? Again, I would check.
I went to the GM Dealership in town today where I had my Burb serviced ever since I purchased it. They know me there pretty well since I have been driving GM Products for the last 15 years and had always taken my trucks for service there. The service advisor as well as the parts guy and two mechanics did compliment me on the exhaust, they thought it fit well, looked good and sounded awesome,.................... I think I received approval on the Pinnacle Exhaust from DA' BOYS.
Let me know if I can assist any further, but in general I am very happy with the system. Also keep in mind that it is less than half as it would be from Banks. They quoted me 625 dollars for an identical system. I paid 285 dollars from Pinnacle Exhaust and I can therefore live with the few little "imperfections" on the hangers which one can not see anyhow. The 4" inch pipe in the back looks however awesome and it certainly gives the truck a way "thougher" appearance then this little inky dinky stock exhaust pipe.
Good luck.
So, I finally ground the downpipe flange down and the downpipe went on first try with no problems. I hung the rest of the exhaust with only one hanger problem that I had to fix. I have to get a couple of exhaust clamps to completely seal the exhaust were the hangers didn't clamp to. looking at the turbo/downpipe connection it looks like there is a tiny leak. I haven't driven the truck but have started it and the motor seems a little louder. As I was installing the downpipe I noticed it did just barely hit the frame rail, but didn't look like it was going to be a problem.
When I started the truck, I was shocked! Inside the cab I got a lot of exhaust vibrations. The exhaust was louder in the cab, and I guess I just didn't think of that and was hoping the sound would be the same in cab. I do like the exhaust tone from the rear tip. Beings as I haven't driven it yet, I can't say too much until I drive it around for a bit and get used to it. I definitely got what I paid for. It's an alright system for what I paid ($350 w/shipping). I do have to agree with John Kennedy though, that the 3 1/2" exhaust is plenty big for these trucks. Looking at the size of this 4" pipe, its huge! Not a bad system though.
Jochen Woern
11-01-2007, 06:10
Hi Kenneth,
Well, glad you got the exhaust on, but I am sorry you are shocked. Not sure why you thought the exhaust would sound the same like the stock one with the same noise? Look at the size difference.
Well, I absolutely love mine and I am happy that I did not pay more than twice for the same thing from Banks.
Hope you will be able to fix the leaks and get the other clamps in order to get it all installed correctly.
You will then as well hopefully enjoy your Pinnacle Exhaust.
Take care.
I got all the leaks fixed and system altogether how I want and it sounds pretty good. Once I got the leaks fixed and the system adjusted the in-cab sound level and vibrations went down a lot! I don't know if this is normal or if it means I still have an exhaust leak on my turbo/downpipe but I can hear the turbo spool up in the engine compartment through the glovebox area. I thought you would only hear the turbo spool from the exhaust, but I am really hoping I am dead wrong and hearing it in the engine comp. through the glovebox is normal.
I definitely am happy with my purchase. It took me a little longer to install it, but with a little time and patience, I am happy.
93GMCSierra
11-01-2007, 13:21
I got all the leaks fixed and system altogether how I want and it sounds pretty good. Once I got the leaks fixed and the system adjusted the in-cab sound level and vibrations went down a lot! I don't know if this is normal or if it means I still have an exhaust leak on my turbo/downpipe but I can hear the turbo spool up in the engine compartment through the glovebox area. I thought you would only hear the turbo spool from the exhaust, but I am really hoping I am dead wrong and hearing it in the engine comp. through the glovebox is normal.
I definitely am happy with my purchase. It took me a little longer to install it, but with a little time and patience, I am happy.
as far as I know with the larger exhaust and the cool air intake you should hear the turbo spooling inside the cab.
I have a stock air box on my 94
93GMCSierra
11-01-2007, 14:13
you also have the turbo master, might make up for it I had stock air box an stock exhaust then cut out the muffler, no other mods and I could hear the turbo spool abit. I added a home made cool air and then I heard the turbo even more. I imagine if I changed the exhaust which I plan on doing, I will hear it alot more.
I added a home made cool air and then I heard the turbo even more.
What design did you come up with? Could you post some pictures?
Jochen Woern
11-01-2007, 21:13
You will definitely hear the turbo spool inside the cab, I call it a "whistle". It is normal, nothing to worry about. I am glad you are now happy with your purchase and all is installed the way you like it.
As mentioned before, I am truly happy with my Pinnacle Exhaust.
93GMCSierra
11-02-2007, 01:45
What design did you come up with? Could you post some pictures?
I will take some pic's but they will have to wait, I had the crankshaft break, or most likely, an I have not been able to go get the truck its about 120 miles away.
But to explain it very simply I took a decent sized round filter used a small piece of pvc pipe 3 1/2 " outer diameter and attached it to the plastic intake attached to the turbo put the filter on the other side and then took a splash guard that came from a sentra and cut it down to fit. It now sits over the intake an holds against the battery and the coolant overflow tank, allowing the air on the engine side to stay away and the cooler air coming from the snorkel to go into the filter.
Jochen Woern
11-02-2007, 06:09
Good morning Kenneth and 93GMCSierra, how are you?
So, what 93GMCSierra is saying is that he basically build himself the same filter as already available by aFe as shown on the attached picture.
I will take some pic's but they will have to wait, I had the crankshaft break, or most likely, an I have not been able to go get the truck its about 120 miles away.
But to explain it very simply I took a decent sized round filter used a small piece of pvc pipe 3 1/2 " outer diameter and attached it to the plastic intake attached to the turbo put the filter on the other side and then took a splash guard that came from a sentra and cut it down to fit. It now sits over the intake an holds against the battery and the coolant overflow tank, allowing the air on the engine side to stay away and the cooler air coming from the snorkel to go into the filter.
Not sure if the "home made" version is any better or cheaper??? I would lean towards a product that has been engineered by Professionals and that I know will fit and is backed up by a company with a warranty.
I bought my aFe filter on eBay at the time for $225 PLUS Shipping and in my opinion is worth every penny. I noticed an increase of power more after the air intake installation then when I installed the Pinnacle Exhaust. The stock airbox sucks and should go. I would also remove the snorkel out of the fender as suggested on this website.
Yeah, my snorkel is gone. I took it out a while ago. I just don't want to spend $225 right now. I got plenty of time and enjoy fabrication and would like building my own "cold air" intake. I worked in a shop building new tree shakers for a couple summers and was welding and doing fabrication and the last summer I worked there I was assembling hydraulic pumps, radiators, oil coolers, etc to a engine skid and then installing that engine skid into the machine. So, I would rather do that than spen a couple hundred dollars on something I could make for under half of that.
93GMCSierra
11-02-2007, 12:43
Yes what is shown is basically what I made, however I spent only $30 on my system, it however does not look as neat an clean as the pre-made version.
cmadmaxman
11-04-2007, 09:07
Got my exhaust on with some problems. The flange went ok, but the only hanger that went on without a problem was the first one. The second one I had to move to the back of the cross frame and re-bend. I had to do that so that the clamp was in the right position for the muffler to clamp on the pipe. The last two I had to cut off and re-postion complety. The B&W Goose hitch could have been some of my problems with that.
The bigest problem that I had was that Pinnacle had the 3 1/2" to 4" pipe welded at the wrong angle. Must have sliped in their fixture. Talked with Pinnacle about my problems and said that they would make sure that they put a truck up on the racks and double check things out.
Buy the way the system is a 3" down pipe to a 3 1/2" then to a 4" stright thru muffler and 4" tail pipe.
Good sounding system, just some install problems. Having it up on the rack while working on it helped a bunch.
I didn't like the hangers on mine setup cause they didn't fit how they should. In fact, over thanksgiving, when I get some time, I am going to cut the hangers off my stock exhaust and adjust my new exhaust how I want it and weld the old hangers to the new exhaust. I like the security of the old hangers compared to the new smooth hangers with no catch on them. Right now, the rubber on the hangers are in weird positions so the exhaust fits. When I weld the old hangers on the new system I can adjust the hangers so they fit the truck and exhaust perfect. It's sure is nice to have access to welders and fabrication tools/equipment.
Looking back, I wish I would have gone with a 3 1/2" exhaust over the 4". I don't like how tight the 4" sits. If i were to do it over again I would have gone with Kennedy Diesel's exhaust. I am sure the quality is a little better and I wouldn't have had to do all the previous welding to hangers and the future welding for proper adjustment.
Can anyone recommend the Pinnacle to someone who does not have access to a lift or torches and welding tools? What about the Kennedy, same question. I would like to do this at home and not need to drive half installed to the local muffler shop for some welding/cutting not to mention thier best hourly rates!
I would love to here about more experiences with either exhust or point me to the correct threads.
DmaxMaverick
11-12-2007, 11:53
I can't speak of any personal experience with the Pinnacle system, but I've installed a few Kennedy systems. The only adjustment needed was handled with a hack saw to adjust the pipe outlet length (although not necessary, but for a custom finish). The clamps and hangers were simple and fit easily, as was the kit as a whole.
I would not recommend the Pinnacle exhaust. For 1, a 4" exhaust is unnecesary, and is a tight fit. 2. I am happy with my exhaust, but if I were to do it again, I would NOT buy the pinnacle exhaust. I had to grind down the diameter of the downpipe flange so it would match the diameter of the turbo flange, I had to refab hangers so the exhaust would hang right. It took me about a total of 10 hours to get my exhaust to fit right. Granted, I did spend a lot of time trying to get the downpipe to fit before I realized it was too big for the turbo flange/v-clamp to clamp onto.
I would recommend Kennedy diesel for a couple reasons. They offer a 3 1/2" exhaust which would fit a little easier and from others I have talked to they seem to install easier and the hangers, etc require no adjustment. I had a lot of hassle with the pinnacle exhaust, and beings as I did not want to eat the cost and go buy a Kennedy exhaust, I have made a lot of refabrications to the exhuast. With my 4" exhaust I had to put a slight dent in the downpipe so it would fit around the frame of the truck because Pinnacle didn't put the right bend so I could rotate the downpipe a little more to go around the frame. Although, I have heard from quite a few people good things about Pinnacle, and theirs installed quite nicely and in short time. I guess with Pinnacle its a hit or miss type thing. If you don't have the fabrication tools, welder, grinder, torch, and time, I wouldn't mess with Pinnacle and would go with Kennedy. It is more money, but I think it is worth it after spending all the hassle and time with my pinnacle exhaust.
Thanks, sounds like I'll be saving my pennies a little longer. The Pinnacle is the right price. For the KD price plus shipping I can have an exhaust guy in town put on his brand: 3" down, 3.5" to exhust & 4" out the back. I've got a few months to think about it.
Thanks for everyone's input. My goal is to let this engine run the best it can as close to stock as possible. Let the gases out and (I'm working on) let the oxygen in. I'd like to see 250,000 before I give up on this truck.
a5150nut
11-12-2007, 19:36
Thanks, sounds like I'll be saving my pennies a little longer. The Pinnacle is the right price. For the KD price plus shipping I can have an exhaust guy in town put on his brand: 3" down, 3.5" to exhust & 4" out the back. I've got a few months to think about it.
.
Is the local guy going to use mandrel bends or wrinkle bends?
Sounds like he buys a mandrel bent from some where. I'd see it before I'd buy it.
yeah, just make sure its mandrel bent. I would have your local guy do it before I got one from Pinnacle.
I bought my exhaust for my 2500 from Jardine and it fit perfectly but was rough in the fit and finish of the welds. I bought my second exhaust, for my K3500 from Warpspeed. It is actually made by Diamond Eye Performance in Athena, Oregon. The workmanship on the diamond eye is head and shoulders above the Jardine system. All CNC mandrel bent tubing. I haven't put the new system on the one ton yet, but I have spoken to those that use diamond eye systems and they claim it is totally top notch.
Both vendors have been good to me, but the diamond eye looks better, smoother in the inside. The transition from the adaptor piece coming off the turbo was welded in on Jardines and it was very rough with part of the tube protuding into the exhaust stream, it is all one piece and smooth on the diamond eye. Looks to be mandrel shrunk on diamond eye.
Jardine is 3 inch leaving the turbo, 3 1/2 inch to the muffler area, 4 inch out the back.
Diamond Eye is 3 inch leaving the turbo, and transitions to 4 inch at the bottom of the bellhousing (just before the cat area) all the way to the back.
George
Like I said before, it's a hit or miss thing with Jardine. I have heard both good and bad. It just seems I always get the short end of the the stick though. With Jardine, you definitely get what you pay for. I haven't heard of Diamond Eye Performance, but I am sure it's better than Jardine. I mean, with the exhaust I got, almost anything is better. BUT, many people have gotten good systems from Jardine. So, I will say it again it is a hit or miss with Jardine.
Good luck with your Diamond Eye Performance exhaust. How much did it cost?
Had it several months now, don't remember the exact price, but it was dollar for dollar for what I paid for the Jardine sytem, not more than $15 either way. And I got an additional item from them, a mandrel bent 2 1/2 inch crossover. Can't wait till I get a chance to put the system on, it will sound great, that I am sure.
They are available on eBay, look for Warpspeed or do a google and call them directly, they are in Gentry, Arkansas if my memory serves me well. They are who I purchased mine from.
Or, look up Diamond Eye Performance on the web and do a dealer search or call them and ask for a dealer in your area.
Best of luck.
George
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