View Full Version : 1997 GMC 2500 6.5 TD Regular Cab 4 x 4 auto...should I buy it!
Ms54Coupe
12-03-2010, 12:06
Dealer took it in on trade in and it has sat because after the customer drove it in the dealer could not get it started again...I would say it is a good sign that they drove it in but a bad sign that its not running now...unless its just the PMD or the Fuel Transfer Pump...the dealer is not willing to address the issue themselves so I may be able to get a deal out of them...I offered $1,500 as is...I may be going up to look at it/work on it this weekend its about 100 miles away from me. What should I be looking for? What would be a major sign NOT to buy it once I get there and begin trouble shooting?
Thanks guys hopefully I'll have my ride listed in the sig soon!
-Nate
Ms54Coupe
12-03-2010, 12:48
Pic for reference...
85-m1028
12-03-2010, 13:07
The non start issue is prob related to the fuel system or ground problems. I would most concerned with the overall condition of the truck.
1. transmission health
2. brakes, pads, rotors, master cylinder, abs stuff.
3. health of the batts
4. interior stuff, PDL, Power windows, door hinges, upholstery, power acc.
5. does the A/C, heater work?
6. steering gear, tie rods, power steering pump?
7. tire tread, how many miles can you get out of current set of tires.
If the overall condition of the stuff mentioned above is fair then you could focus time and resource on mechanical issues. If not then it can quickly become not such a good deal!
ask me how I know! :)
Ms54Coupe
12-03-2010, 13:40
Well you have painted a scary picture which is telling me to TURN AND RUN hahahaha Thanks for the helpful info!
The non start issue is prob related to the fuel system or ground problems. I would most concerned with the overall condition of the truck.
1. transmission health
2. brakes, pads, rotors, master cylinder, abs stuff.
3. health of the batts
4. interior stuff, PDL, Power windows, door hinges, upholstery, power acc.
5. does the A/C, heater work?
6. steering gear, tie rods, power steering pump?
7. tire tread, how many miles can you get out of current set of tires.
If the overall condition of the stuff mentioned above is fair then you could focus time and resource on mechanical issues. If not then it can quickly become not such a good deal!
ask me how I know! :)
Its probably worth that in parts....
6.5 Detroit Diesel
12-03-2010, 17:11
Its probably worth that in parts....
yea, i would agree with you. but, he is looking for a running truck. if it was me, i would snap it up for 1500. but then, i have running vehicles so i wouldn't need it running right away.
he could be looking for a while to get it running again. i would say buyer beware, this truck may give you some excessive grief.
85-m1028
12-05-2010, 12:55
Well you have painted a scary picture which is telling me to TURN AND RUN hahahaha Thanks for the helpful info!
Well I got a truck that was mechanicaly strong, I.E. engine and trans. Within the first six months I,
*Replaced two batts
*new brakes all around
*new tie rods and alignment
*new hinge pins and bushings, and buba patched the auged out hole that let the door sag 1/2"
*bled the brake lines and replaced all fluids
still need new tires, and new PS pump. for the price on that truck I would say go for it just give it a good look over and be prepared to fix the extras you find..
6.5 Detroit Diesel
12-05-2010, 13:43
just looking a little closer, that blue detailing looks sick on the truck!
Ms54Coupe
12-06-2010, 09:08
Thanks Guys! I am going to go look at it and possibly buy it...I think for the price I could get back out of it and get my money back if I needed to. I'll keep you updated. I was thinking of getting a PMD ahead of time and installing it while I was looking at it to see if that was the issue...what are your thoughts on this idea? Is it a tough part to replace? Is it worth the gamble that it is not the PMD?
Nate
Ms54Coupe
12-06-2010, 13:58
Is there a way to test the pump in order to determine if the starting issue is the Pump vs PMD? I have read that the best way to test the PMD is to replace it and see if the problem goes away haha. Is there a more specific way to test the pump itself to tell if it is bad?
If you put in a PMD before you buy it and it fixes the problem, the price may go up significantly.
Bob
Agreed. I would not do that. Heck, worst case, you could loose the PMD....
Ms54Coupe
12-07-2010, 11:12
Ok, I'll just buy it and tow it home and then get to work on it and hopefully it won't be anything too major to get it going (crosses fingers)
Yukon6.2
12-08-2010, 09:09
Hi
Lowball their price and get them to tow it to your place,convice them it's in their best interest to clear their lot of a non running vehical.They are probley worried about the cost to get it running so they can recoup the few dollars they have in it.
Good Luck
Thomas
6.5 Detroit Diesel
12-08-2010, 11:33
yea, yukon's advice is pretty good there. like others have said as well, if you really aren't to worried about it, if it fails to run, part it out.
don't know how it is down there, but those OE rims in nice shape will sell easily for over $500 up here.
i would doubt it's your IP and focus on that PMD first, especially if it's in the stock location. after that, check for fuel to filter, fuel to the injectors. have fun
Ms54Coupe
12-08-2010, 13:16
I did lowball them and they accepted my 1500 offer (they were asking 4,000).
The dealer is 120 miles away so I don't think they would be willing to combine the low price with the towing too. I have lined up a friend in the construction business to tow it home with his 3500 and dual axle trailer.
Might be the owner of a GMC on Saturday : )
6.5 Detroit Diesel
12-08-2010, 17:48
if they were asking 4K for it, and you got it for 1500, then you my friend got a steal.
if i was closer i would offer you 2500 for that truck as is.
good luck with it! any help you needed will be provided from here.
6.5TDTahoe
12-08-2010, 21:25
Don' start throwing money at it!! I would go for finding the former owner. His name/adress will be on the title. may find a phone # once you have the name.The dealer might let you have the #. Good luck!!
Ms54Coupe
12-09-2010, 06:12
Don' start throwing money at it!! I would go for finding the former owner. His name/adress will be on the title. may find a phone # once you have the name.The dealer might let you have the #. Good luck!!
Yes I thought of that too! I wanted to get in touch with him to ask what he knew about the truck and any additional information which could help me make my decisions!
Ms54Coupe
12-09-2010, 06:26
I'll really have gotten a steal if I put a PMD in it and it fires up!!!!!
It is a new england truck and has some rust but I really want to get up to it and see it in person and make the deal if everything is as described/appears in pics.
if they were asking 4K for it, and you got it for 1500, then you my friend got a steal.
if i was closer i would offer you 2500 for that truck as is.
good luck with it! any help you needed will be provided from here.
Ms54Coupe
12-09-2010, 09:50
I think I am heading up and going to buy it. If I do buy it I will try to start it and drive it home from the lot...What should I bring with me to help me out (assume that the PMD fixes the no start issue).
I was thinking I'll bring a fresh fuel filter, a jumper box, tools (anything out of the ordinary?) a can of fresh diesel (to prime the fuel filter and add to the tank just in case.
what am I missing?
Ms54Coupe
12-09-2010, 09:59
PS what are the bolts that hold the old PMD on? I understand I will probably just un clip it and clip in the replacement remotely (leaving the stock PMD mounted to the pump for the time being). But I was wondering are they allen head bolts? Something I could put on a ratchet and back them out etc?
DmaxMaverick
12-09-2010, 14:27
Removing the old PMD, in your situation, would be a major operation. For the short period you'll be running it (if it runs), and the cool current temperatures, you should just mount it to the intake, where the original harness will reach. However, it doesn't sound to me like the PMD. Probably something simple like glow plugs. Loosen a couple injector line nuts and crank the engine. If fuel weeps, it isn't the PMD. Lack of heat is the cause. You did say it was driven into the dealer, but they couldn't restart it later. Not typical of a PMD failure, but may be GP's or other electrical issue (like an aftermarket alarm/security system).
Time permitting (2-4 hours), you could bring along a generator and use the block heater (600+ watts) to help get it started. If you find several glow plugs failed, you could (cautiously) disable the glow plug system and give it a shot of ether (starting fluid). With the GP's disabled, fog short bursts into the intake (dirty side of the air cleaner, don't remove the intake cover or filter) WHILE cranking the engine. This is NOT recommended as a regular practice, but occasional use won't likely hurt anything.
93GMCSierra
12-09-2010, 18:04
Removing the old PMD, in your situation, would be a major operation. For the short period you'll be running it (if it runs), and the cool current temperatures, you should just mount it to the intake, where the original harness will reach. However, it doesn't sound to me like the PMD. Probably something simple like glow plugs. Loosen a couple injector line nuts and crank the engine. If fuel weeps, it isn't the PMD. Lack of heat is the cause. You did say it was driven into the dealer, but they couldn't restart it later. Not typical of a PMD failure, but may be GP's or other electrical issue (like an aftermarket alarm/security system).
Time permitting (2-4 hours), you could bring along a generator and use the block heater (600+ watts) to help get it started. If you find several glow plugs failed, you could (cautiously) disable the glow plug system and give it a shot of ether (starting fluid). With the GP's disabled, fog short bursts into the intake (dirty side of the air cleaner, don't remove the intake cover or filter) WHILE cranking the engine. This is NOT recommended as a regular practice, but occasional use won't likely hurt anything.
I have done this, but as mentioned make sure the glows will not lite up, or you will ignite the ether in a very bad way.
if they were asking 4K for it, and you got it for 1500, then you my friend got a steal.
Agreed. Don't press your luck. Tow it out of there and work on it when you get back.
Ms54Coupe
12-10-2010, 07:22
Agreed. Don't press your luck. Tow it out of there and work on it when you get back.
You don't think they would like it if I got it running right in front of them and drove it out :):):)
I'll just tow it home and work on it in the comfort of my 12 degree driveway haha
Ms54Coupe
12-10-2010, 07:24
However, it doesn't sound to me like the PMD. Probably something simple like glow plugs. Loosen a couple injector line nuts and crank the engine. If fuel weeps, it isn't the PMD.
I am going to perform the diagnostic tests once the truck is home and skip the plan of trying to work on it in their lot...the mechanic at the dealership diagnosed the issue as "bad injection pump" which is what leads me to believe it is probably just the PMD with 120,000 miles on the truck. This is the reason for all of my PMD based plans but certainly need to verify the glow plugs and all of the other possible issues too.
Ms54Coupe
12-12-2010, 16:07
ok guys I drove up and looked at the truck on saturday. The truck was as good or better than described. One thing I did not anticipate was to find the PMD already out from its mounting point on the pump and hanging loosely next to the intake. I noticed the PMD did not say stanadyne but had some sort of bar code looking sticker on it which said GM #####. This suggests to me that it is not the PMD. I also noticed that the mechanic who had diagnosed the problem as being the pump had broken a nut loose on one of the injectors and the injector line was hanging close to the cylinder it is went to (tells me they tested for fuel flow. I turned the vehicle over as my father watched the injector line and he said there was a very weak flow of fuel as it turned over. Does this suggest that the mechanic was right about the pump? Could it still be the pmd and its just not amplifying the flow of the pump. I am looking for everyone's opinions.
Other info...the tailgate handle was not hooked up and the tailgate was not original (different color) but I was able to open it by pulling the two rods which should attach to the handle. The door handles on the two front doors would probably need to be replaced (they work but are sort of loose and probably would only get worse). The truck needs tires and the front tires are worn very bald on the inside so probably needs tie rod ends and/or ball joints too. The tailpipe was disconnected (everything looked to be in good condition but was taken apart at the rear axle. Would this be to diagnose an issue with the no start by chance?
ToddMeister
12-12-2010, 17:38
Tailpipe disconnected? Cat converter plugged possibly?
85-m1028
12-12-2010, 18:28
I would definately factor a rebuilt pump and new pmd into the cost.. Did the you hear the lift pump going? how was the flow there? What was the condition of the filters fuel and air.
Take a clear plastic water bottle and fill it fuel from the tank and look for anything abnormal, smell, color, particles?
Ms54Coupe
12-21-2010, 06:43
Update: I bought the truck for $1300 + $280 towing to CT!!!
Details:
1997 GMC 2500 6.5 Regular cab 4x4 Auto.
155,000 miles
Not current running
Turns over but wont fire (yet).
I hope to have the truck back to my house by next week and I can begin my process of getting it running. I am going to drain the fuel in the tank and replace the fuel filter while giving the batteries both full charges (and testing to make sure they are both worth keeping).
I will then move to the list of items you have all given me to inspect and I will test them one after the next until I figure out why it is not running. I am very excited to get it back home so I can begin working on it! Needs tires which is another immediate cost impact but I'll worry about getting it running first and then address the tires.
phantom309
12-21-2010, 08:08
Good deal,.
fuel at the injectors they put out very little when the line is off or loose,. they are poppet style injectors,. that means the pump pushes fuel, the injector holds it back till it reaches a set pressure then it squirts or "pops" off,.if there is no injector at the end of the line to raise line pressure there is only a tiny little bit of fuel that "weeps" out as was mentioned before,.
In your particular case,. i,d be checking glow plugs,easy quick check is test light hooked to battery power, diconnect the wire to the glow plug then touch the test light to the tab, if the test light lights up,. you have a complete circuit, if it doesn't light up,. the glow plug is burned out,. This test will not tell you how good the glow plug is tho,..and i wouldn't worry so much about the old fuel in the tank,. first i,d empty the fuel filter/manager on the back of the intake and see what you,ve got,. then i,d manually power up the lift pump and see if you have flow,.
as was mentioned if you have fuel flow, mebbe disconnect the glow plugs at the relay on the back of the motor,. and try fogging some starting fluid into the breather,. todays "starting fluid" is a lot less volatile than the old cans of straight ether, can't blow a tire onto a rim anymore unless you use damn near 1/2 a can, and even then it's a much slower bang,.
nick
Yukon6.2
12-21-2010, 09:05
Hi
If you have a wrecking yard nearby,spend a bit of time looking around if you can you should be able to find some decent tires cheep,probley find some with wheels if you live in snow country,then you can have summer and winter wheels with the tires on them.
Good luck
Thomas
AllThumbs
12-21-2010, 16:45
I get all my tires at the bone yard. Never had a problem.
If you need to replace the glow plugs, and you probably should, you will almost certainly have to drop the down pipe to get at #6. Other than that, it is just a lot of squirming around to get to where you can reach them.
Nick, What is this "blow a tire onto a rim" with ether? Would you explain? Never heard of that but it sounds like it could get exciting real quick.
Bob
Ms54Coupe
12-22-2010, 06:23
Nick, What is this "blow a tire onto a rim" with ether? Would you explain? Never heard of that but it sounds like it could get exciting real quick.
Bob
When you are re mounting a tire and need to set the bead without a tire machine an old trick is to get the tire on the rim (flat) and spray the ether into the tire and then drop a match. When the fluid lights it sets the tire to the rim. My neighbor used to use this trick with really large tires (tractor/skidder).
Ms54Coupe
12-22-2010, 09:17
Holy Moley glow plugs are $22.00 each!!!
Yukon6.2
12-22-2010, 09:28
Hi
Depends on where you buy the plugs.Try to get some wellman quick heat plugs,makes the start so much better.Watch what brand you buy some are junk.Do the search to find the good and bad plugs and shop around.
Good luck
Thomas
DmaxMaverick
12-22-2010, 10:34
Holy Moley glow plugs are $22.00 each!!!
Save yourself a lot of time, effort, grief and money. Check out the TDP Advertisers (http://www.thedieselpage.com/vendors/main.htm). Many of them offer quality glow plugs at good prices. I use and recommend Kennedy QH (quick heat). They work as well/better as any, at a good price. $10 ea. in a full set (it is almost always recommended to replace a full set). You won't worry/wonder about the seller or support, with any TDP supporter.
Ms54Coupe
12-22-2010, 11:02
Save yourself a lot of time, effort, grief and money. Check out the TDP Advertisers (http://www.thedieselpage.com/vendors/main.htm). Many of them offer quality glow plugs at good prices. I use and recommend Kennedy QH (quick heat). They work as well/better as any, at a good price. $10 ea. in a full set (it is almost always recommended to replace a full set). You won't worry/wonder about the seller or support, with any TDP supporter.
Awesome thanks guys!!!!
AllThumbs
12-22-2010, 18:16
I have a set of Wellman's and they are fast and hot. Never a problem starting.
Ms54Coupe
12-25-2010, 11:38
Santa brought me a Stanadyne bullet proof PMD with upgraded harness!!!!
Buy it, well tow it to the dump if we have to.
6.5 Detroit Diesel
01-02-2011, 13:29
Buy it, well tow it to the dump if we have to.
coupe, friend of yours?? ^ ^
have some faith, you will get this truck running. i have went through a lot of headaches with vehicles, especially diesels, but the feeling you get when that puppy fires up is awesome. ;)
Ms54Coupe
01-02-2011, 14:20
coupe, friend of yours?? ^ ^
have some faith, you will get this truck running. i have went through a lot of headaches with vehicles, especially diesels, but the feeling you get when that puppy fires up is awesome. ;)
Yes, my soon to be brother in law : )
I appreciate the encouragement and will ride this one out for awhile before giving up!
6.5 Detroit Diesel
01-03-2011, 12:26
if nothing else, it will give you some really good experience trouble shooting these engines. they have a few quirks, but once figured out aren't to much more trouble. it's just figuring them out. ;)
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