Installing a 6.5L Drop-in Into an 85 Burb.

[TimK]

Since my 6.2L engine went to hell a couple of weeks ago I have been looking for a 6.5L drop in replacement engine. No one advertises 6.2L drop-in. Unforntunately all of the "drop-in" replacements are not listed for my 85 Suburban. All I can get for it is a 6.5L long block. I figured if I am replacing the motor I might as well pay to get the 6.5L drop-in with the turbo and mechanical pump. I realize I will have to redo the exhaust but that is minor. (I figured the Banks swidewinder exhaust would be a good place to start.)

Can anyone tell my why I can't place the 6.5L with turbo in my 85 Burb. The places selling engines (including the ones advertising on this website) are reluctant to sell me one for my model year. Any info would be helpful. Would the 6.5L turbo for the G-van work?

TimK

[john8662]

What is a 6.5 Drop-in engine? I am just asking because what all is included when the phrase "drop-in" us used? If this is a drop-in engine like I think of it, it will have the IP, injectors, lines, intake, exaust manifolds, brackets for accessories. The problem with a drop-in 6.5 is that ALL the brackets are different from what the 6.2 has. The exaust manifolds are different, and the 6.5 turbo setup won't exactly fit in the 85 burb. The turbo system interferes with the air-conditioning equipment under the hood (clearance issue). Some members have adapted the 6.5 turbo system into the older body style trucks, but I think if they had to do it over again would choose the banks route.

The best solution is to get a 6.5 longblock. That way you can re-use your injection pump (better yet, have the IP freshend up) throw in some rebuilt injectors, and some glow plugs. Then bolt everything up to the 6.5 just as you would the 6.2. Think of the 6.5 as a 6.2. The only differences you are going to run into is the injector lines will have to be bent slightly as the heads on the 6.5 have the injectors in them at a slightly different angle. Then throw on the banks turbo, use the money you would have spent on the drop in for a complete banks turbo kit for a 6.2 ($1,200). You won't have to worry about adapting the exaust that way, because the exaust comes with the kit. You should be able to get a great deal on a longblock 6.5 verses paying for a drop-in engine that most of the accesories won't fit without a headache.

As far as the G-van 6.5's, if it is the turbo version of these engines, this definitly won't work as a drop-in for your application. The G-van (also Hummer H1) 6.5's use a center mounted turbo that uses an entrirely different system than whats on the trucks. There won't be a way to make this fit in an 80's truck because of the way the exaust comes off the turbo and where the turbo is. This engine is designed to have a "dog house" for the extra space with the turbo, otherwise the turbo will conflict with the firewall.

Good luck!

[britannic]

Note: if you go the long block route, get your IP pump rebuilt to 4911 specs. You may want to post a question on the 6.5LTD page to get some measurements to see if the A/C would clash with the 6.5LTD set up. BTW, there are a number of variations on the turbo position, for example, some of the Hummer H1 engines were configured with a center mount turbo.

[TimK]

John,

Thank you for the response. It was looking like the 6.5 long block was the way to go. I will definetly be getting the IP replaced when I do this. The prices that I am being quoted for the 6.2L Banks Turbo kits are about $2500. You mentioned getting one for $1200. Have priced gone since you last priced these or do you have a really good source for turbo kits?

TimK

[82beast]

Hello All
On the issue of wheather or not the GM turbo setup interfers with the A\C I can assure it does as that is the turbo set that I am using. My heat and a\c are located completely under the dash. While the GM turbo setup runs great(GM-8 turbo) and makes getting parts for it easier the under dash hvac system(vintage air setup) was a pita to install and I personlly would not use ever again. :mad:
I choose the to go the GM turbo route because I needed to make a lot of low end power for four-wheeling. Course if you dont want a\c you will have no clearance problems. :D

ON Edit: I forgot to mention that if you run the GM setup you will have to custom make your downpipe. I have pictures of mine, I would post them if I could figure out how. :confused:

[ 12-22-2003, 06:21 PM: Message edited by: 82beast ]

[john8662]

Tim,

The Banks kits are not as expensive as 2500. I remember Diesel Injection Service having them from around 1200. I'll check for the new Banks distributor for these kits and post it here.

John

[britannic]

Originally posted by john8662:
Tim,

The Banks kits are not as expensive as 2500. I remember Diesel Injection Service having them from around 1200. I'll check for the new Banks distributor for these kits and post it here.

John I paid $1900 delivered for the complete kit that included, gauges, exhaust system and turbo, a year ago.

[Dieselboy]

If I remember right, the reason that DIS priced their Banks stuff so low is because they were dropping the whole line.

[cschneider]

Dieselboy is correct, DIS no longer carries the Banks kit as of last year. As far as a drop-in vs. a long block that is a judgement call based on the miles on your injection system. There is no difference between a 6.5L long block or 6.2L as far as the engine goes or what application. An '85 Suburban (a fine piece of hardware if I do say so myself) will fit whatever you want. The GM* turbo setup isn't worth the trouble if you want your A/C so your stuck with getting a banks. If your looking for suggestions on where to get the drop-in or long block, I got mine at Diesel Auto Services and can't say enough good things about Paul and his team. Give them a call and they can walk you through all you need to know.

[More Power]

In addition to what has already been said, you might want to take a look at the following member tech piece that discusses just such a swap.
http://www.thedieselpage.com/members/swap6265.htm

This is linked from the "Member's Area" reference section.

Good luck,

MP

[grape]

DON'T WASTE MONEY ON THE BANKS!!!!!!!

[cschneider]

Don't listen to grape!

[JeepSJ]

Originally posted by grape:
DON'T WASTE MONEY ON THE BANKS!!!!!!! Care to elaborate? Statements like this don't carry much credibility without some information to back it up. Please share your experiences.

[grape]

I'll sell you mine.....that's all i'm gonna say. Come ride in my truck if you don't belive me. Along with it being a total turd.....nothing in the exhaust system fit. I don't care what these people think on this board, they've put maybe 1 turbo on a 20 year old diesel and now they are experts. I'll email you with my experience with turbos on gasonline powered cars that I built and the magazine articles that covered them.

[Dieselboy]

While I'm not a big fan of the T04B that comes with the Banks kit, I believe that it has value for someone that is new to turbocharging engines. The kit is simple (and time consuming) to install, but the instructions are very detailed. A typical weekend warrior mechanic that has a working knowledge of the motor could do it.

There are other options too...

If you want some more giddy up, then I suggest adapting a MHI TE06H turbo. There's plenty of info on these forums, so do a search.

Both Brittanic and I have some pictures of the process:
Brittanic's pics (http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4289944317&code=5535208&mode=invite)
Mine (http://www.oliverdiesel.com/tech/mhiturbo.htm)

And if you're really wanting to tear into her and do something original, take a lesson of Peter Bierman. He's done something different from all of us with his CUCV/Volvo twin-turbo diesel, and his notes are part of this months features articles.

I wouldn't go so far as to call the Banks kit a waste of money. It certainly doesn't satisfy my power needs [read: wants ;) ], but it might work for you.

[grape]

That's just it......the banks is NOT totally a T04b, and even if it was, there are no telling how many different variations of that turbo exist. Telling somebody you have a T04b is like saying you went to the bar and got a "mixed drik".....just a tad bit vague. The b refers to physical size..2.75" inlet and 2" outlet on the housing. A T04E has a 4" inlet and a 2.5" outlet. The inlet side is a T04b but the exhaust side is the same dinky t3 that all the little *** cars throw away after about 200 horsepower, the same family that the gm-x series exhaust housings belongs too. It is a hybrid T04/T3 which is extremely common. Look on various aftermarket turbo companys for installation diagrams and you'll find the measurements on the two different families of housings.

[britannic]

Originally posted by grape:
That's just it......the banks is NOT totally a T04b, and even if it was, there are no telling how many different variations of that turbo exist. Telling somebody you have a T04b is like saying you went to the bar and got a "mixed drik".....just a tad bit vague. The b refers to physical size..2.75" inlet and 2" outlet on the housing. A T04E has a 4" inlet and a 2.5" outlet. The inlet side is a T04b but the exhaust side is the same dinky t3 that all the little *** cars throw away after about 200 horsepower, the same family that the gm-x series exhaust housings belongs too. It is a hybrid T04/T3 which is extremely common. Look on various aftermarket turbo companys for installation diagrams and you'll find the measurements on the two different families of housings. Grape: out of interest, what are the inlet and outlet sizes of your turbine, your description doesn't match the Banks T04B hybrid I had, which is huge when compared to the Mitsubishi turbo on my 250HP Saab Viggen. It's also much, much bigger than the Holset fitted to the 2002 Dodge Cummins.

The outlet on my old Banks turbo was 3", you can check out the pictures of it @: Banks Sidewinder Turbo (http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4289276535&code=7782952&mode=invite)

[ 01-05-2004, 06:00 AM: Message edited by: britannic ]

[JeepSJ]

OK, you guys really have me thinking about these turbos. Since I am piecing together parts from different kits to get this thing installed, I am thinking that it wouldn't be much, if any, additional work to use the TE06H over the T04b.

What kind of gains did you see with the TE06H over the "stock" Banks turbo?

[Dieselboy]

Originally posted by JeepSJ:
What kind of gains did you see with the TE06H over the "stock" Banks turbo? Look for the turbo to spool up faster, and the wastegate does allow some control against over-boosting. As long as you take your time, and follow the old adage of measure three times and cut once, you'll be fine.

As JD frequently says, "try it; you'll like it." :D