Towing capacities kodiak v. 3500

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02-17-2008, 18:49
Braveheart

Towing capacities kodiak v. 3500

I just noticed that Chevrolet has a nice trailering link on their site which shows the maximum GCWR and max trailer weights of all their major trucks. To figure max trailer weight you just have to subtract curb weight plus driver. They've done this for you.

http://www.chevrolet.com/trailering/

It shows the 3500HD series to have a 16,500 lb trailering capacity--maximum--with a 3500 Duramax, 3.73 equipped, standard cab dually. By my calculation it should actually be 17,200 assuming a 200 lb driver 23,000 GCWR and 6093 curbweight for the regular cab dually. They also show the correct 26,000 lb GCWR for the Kodiak, but fail to note the max trailer weight on the bar graph for the Kodiak. The Kodiak is the only truck which is missing this. So I had to do a little head scratching. The lightest Kodiak pickup is the 2wd 4500--that should be a known value.

An article on autoblog states the curbweight of the Kodiak is 10,000 lbs where the max curbweight of the most potent 3500 is 6093 lbs. That actually makes the 3500 "rated" to pull 500 lbs more than the Kodiak, or again based on my calculations, about 1407lbs more. Has this been discussed before?
02-18-2008, 22:53
murphyslaw

The major part of towing that the kodiak wins is in breaking power. because it it heavier it can stop more weight safely.
02-19-2008, 21:21
Mark Rinker

Yes, it has been discussed before, with plenty of head-scratching.

The 26,000GCWR is obviously an attempt to keep the truck under CDL rules. This is further confused by the air over hydraulic braking system. Technically they are NOT air brakes which always requires a CDL. However, once you have an air system involved in the braking process, it sure gets confusing for the DOT inspectors and examiners. Its a grey area, and when interpreting grey, the law usually wins - or at least writes the ticket and lets the judge figure it out.

Bottom line - if you plan to tow a flatbed gooseneck trailer behind a Kodiak, you better have a CDL, and stop at the scales. End of story.

I would place the 'effective GCWR' for the Kodiak 4500 at 32000. I have hauled and scaled and been inspected at or near that weight with no issue. My C4500 is licensed for 18K and the trailers it pulls are licensed for for 15K. (33K combo minus 11K truck/driver/gear minus 5K empty trailer = 17 MAX cargo IF you can spread it between the truck and trailer properly, i.e I can't haul a 17K boat, or tractor on a trailer, but I can haul 16K with 4K on the flatbed and 12K on the trailer...a Max gooseneck load is ~14K, max flatbed truck load no trailer is ~6K, although the springs will handle 10K no problem.)

However, a DOT officer wanting to make a point (like if you bypassed a scale, were speeding, etc.) could ticket you for combinations over 26K based on the door jamb sticker. Most won't - as its obvious that the truck is capable for larger combinations safely.

Go figure...
02-20-2008, 05:08
Hook_'em_Horns!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Rinker

Yes, it has been discussed before, with plenty of head-scratching.

The 26,000GCWR is obviously an attempt to keep the truck under CDL rules. This is further confused by the air over hydraulic braking system. Technically they are NOT air brakes which always requires a CDL. However, once you have an air system involved in the braking process, it sure gets confusing for the DOT inspectors and examiners. Its a grey area, and when interpreting grey, the law usually wins - or at least writes the ticket and lets the judge figure it out.

Go figure...

Common mistake on air. First, the truck GVWR or combination for GCWR must exceed 26k lbs, then the air brakes endorsement on CDL comes into play. Air (or assist) under 26,001 lbs is not an issue with an operators permit.
02-20-2008, 11:14
Craig M

I do not have a CDL book in front of me, but that is not the way I remember it. I thought a CDL was required for any vehicle that had air brakes!
02-20-2008, 13:02
DmaxMaverick

Air-over brakes are not classified as air brakes, according to federal regs. Individual states may amend the regulation, locally, but for federal commercial purposes, they are not. The air part of the "air over hydraulic brake system" is considered a brake booster system component. The air does not apply the brakes at the wheels, therefore does not qualify. Even commercial vehicles with a GCWR greater than 26,001# with air-over brakes don't require an air brake endorsement.
02-20-2008, 14:09
Hook_'em_Horns!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig M

I do not have a CDL book in front of me, but that is not the way I remember it. I thought a CDL was required for any vehicle that had air brakes!

I referred back to the CDL .pdf and I misspoke a bit. Air brake knowledge is one of the tests and inclusive in CDL licensing, not an endorsement such as Haz-Mat. It is however offered as a item of restriction.

You can have a class A CDL for combinations without Air Brakes. Of course, any truck with true Air Brakes will naturally be in excess of 26K lbs. So, it is somewhat true that you need a CDL for Air.

I will check and take a look the next time I pick up a 4300 with air-ride and brakes (Nice Truck!), it may just be that they are air/hydraulics.
02-20-2008, 22:18
murphyslaw

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hook_'em_Horns!

I will check and take a look the next time I pick up a 4300 with air-ride and brakes (Nice Truck!), it may just be that they are air/hydraulics.

the last int. 4300 I drove had true airbrakes.
09-15-2011, 10:08
Vern2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Rinker

Technically they are NOT air brakes which always requires a CDL.

Air brakes don't require a CDL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DmaxMaverick

Air-over brakes are not classified as air brakes, according to federal regs..........Even commercial vehicles with a GCWR greater than 26,001# with air-over brakes don't require an air brake endorsement.

Air over are considered air brakes according t the feds. And there is no such thing as an air brake endorsement on a CDL.
09-15-2011, 10:09
Vern2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hook_'em_Horns!

for combinations without Air Brakes. Of course, any truck with true Air Brakes will naturally be in excess of 26K lbs. So, it is somewhat true that you need a CDL for Air.

That is not true at all. There are many trucks out there under 26k GVWR with "true" air brakes.