Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 45

Thread: Do NOT use Amsoil synthetic diesel oil!

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
    Posts
    281

    Post

    I don't know Greg, but I'm sure he is a great guy. He's just one of a huge number of people that are taken in by Amsoil. Amsoil has a very slick way of producing sales literature that appears to be of value on the surface, but falls apart under investigation.

    Beware of any company that claims that every one of their products is the very best in the world. I'm sure that some of the Amsoil products are very good but it's difficult to tell which ones when they put out deceptive information on the rest of their products.

    I'm not on a crusade against Amsoil, but I do want to make sure that the truth is available for people to make their own decisions.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Tulsa
    Posts
    74

    Post

    csimo is correct in his technical evaluation of the facts. Amsoil attempts to purposely mislead it's customers.

    Furthermore, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act will NOT protect you when using products that do not meet the manufacturer's specifications.

    This leads back to my question in the other thread- Has anyone personally or even know someone who has successfully made a claim against Amsoil's corporate warranty?

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    347

    Post

    The Amsoil folk remind me of a brainwashed "cult". Ever notice how Amsoil reminds you of Amway? I've personally never used it other than my air filter but, I have seen many snow mobiles blow up while running Amsoil. I certainly wouldn't use it if it doesn't have official certification no matter how many notes from their mothers the Amsoil gang shows me.
    2003 GMC 2500HD 4x4 6.6 Diesel <br />443+HP/944LB-FT unstacked #2 only

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Minneapolis, MN
    Posts
    44

    Angry

    Not To confuse or mislead, but I got this from morepower:

    Hi Chad,

    The Amsoil marine 15W-40 synthetic carries the CG-4 API engine oil rating.
    Any API rated oil of CG-4 or CH-4 is prefectly acceptable for your diesel
    engine, and warranties cannot be voided because of brand - as long as they
    carry the right API rating.

    Visit the American Petroleum Institute web site to learn more about engine
    oil ratings.

    The following link contains more info about the tick.

    http://www.thedieselpage.com/duramax/durafaq.htm

    Jim


    TheDieselPage.com
    Jim Bigley

    How was I told this, and I'm reading something different??, Are we on the same page here???
    2002 Chev Dmax/Allison cc/sb,Summit White, BF Goodrich 265,75R-16, SS sep bars, Truxedo Pics-http://www.pbase.com/bigwheel/new_dmax

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Stillwater, Minnesota
    Posts
    404

    Post

    NoMo, I agree with Kompressorman's comment about not certifying due to cost. This has nothing to do with Amsoil just the economics of smaller companies trying to play with the big boys as best as they can. My work is in a similar situation. We already have a product certified and the next generation has proven to be better but until the governing body approves it there's no cert. In some cases being in the market without a cert is better than nothing at all.

    I know this will make those of you who change their synthetic at 3000 miles pucker but I'm going to run extended drain intervals on dino oil. My motto, run it till it breaks then you know exactly what's wrong [img]smile.gif[/img] [img]smile.gif[/img] [img]smile.gif[/img]
    2003 GMC 2500HD, DMAX/ZF 6 gear, 4X4, CC/SB, Carbon Metallic, <br />pre OEM CAT filter, H2 wheels & tires. <a href=\"http://community.webshots.com/user/jelisfc\" target=\"_blank\">Pics</a>

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    366

    Post

    I hate to be egotistical about this and I too took alot of BS from other people when I formally took a stand against Scamsoil at the Gm diesel page. I knew from day one that this company was not all it was cracked up to be. I made sure 100 percent I told people what I thought. And what did It get me. I got booted from GM diesel overnight. Bam wham see ya later.
    I still get the Amsoil monthly articles and I wish I kept them because this was really the "icing on the cake" It went over how good there oil was and yada yada yada. It went on to formally quote verbatim, engineers from GM, Dodge, and Ford. Saying that synthetics were good for engines. However Amsoil cut and chopped those engineers statments so much that they conformed the engineers statments to make it look they were personally endorsing SCAMS-OIL, They were not, and obviously knowing now they were never listed by the API, I dont think any engineer would even consider the oil. I got turned away from Amsoil upon purchasing a 2 stage air filter over a year ago. Mackin remember"My oily couch cushion" From there on in (especially after realizing that the company was structured the way it was"Amway" comes to mind) I had it. I sold my filter for 25 bucks and switched over to K&N. And after being told that my Oil Analysis would have silicon amounts off the scale I came in at 15ppm with Dino oil that had 7500 miles on it. Well within the range for the amount of miles on my oil. I knew that one day everyone would see the company for what it was like I did. And Im glad now people do. So ok , now they are API certified on one type of oil. Would you trust this company now after you been using it so long, without even knowing it was never recognized by the API. Hell No. You have to be ally cat smart in todays age, I will stick with what I been using for 3 years now. Citgo Citguard 500. plain ol' dino oil. Ive got an oil analysis waiting to be sent now. I will post my results when they come back. Bill
    "Sometimes its hard to tell the cockels from the wheat"
    2002 Dmax, A few 6.5\'s, And a 6.2 <br />Gmanjr96@aol.com

  7. #27
    jbplock Guest

    Post

    Here is a link to some more discussion on this topic.

    AMSOIL position on API Licensing:

    http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/...=001127#000002

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Central FL
    Posts
    491

    Post

    Amsoil's failure to get an API rating for a specific product is not an economic issue.

    I am familiar with several of the independent blenders listed on csimo's post.

    Most don't realize that base stocks come from only a handfull of suppliers, PAO's come from even a smaller pool of source. The same is true for additives.

    Any independent can buy both and blend a lubricant, this is exactly what some of the companies in csimo's post have done. This is called "Private Labeling".

    Regardless of size of the blender, quality standard is what is required to meet an API rating. This isn't a one sample certification. Many companies fail initially because they can't meet the standard consistently.

    It is possible that this is why Amsoil doesn't have a API rating, also possible this is why API won't difinitively say whether they have tested, and this is why I won't use Amway Oil. I am concerned with the consistency of the blending and packaging process.
    2008 GMC Sierra SLE 2500 HD
    Z71 4x4 Extended cab long bed
    265/70/17 oem aluminum wheels
    6.0 gasser with 6L90 tranny

    2007 Harley Davidson FXSTC
    Softtail Custom
    Too many mods to list

    2005 Contender 25 Open
    Yamaha 200 HPDI's

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    56

    Post

    I am sure this will pi$$ of some but this saved a long tiome ago from another site.

    Q. Why aren't all AMSOIL motor oils API licensed

    A. Good question. AMSOIL staffers have recently read some message boards with misinformation regarding this issue. Let us address API licensing in depth, as well as the issue of warranties. Some AMSOIL motor oils are API licensed, some are not. If you're concerned about your warranty and feel pressures to use an API licensed oil, even after reading this answer, then the 5W-30 (XLF) or 10W-30 (XLT) XL-7500 or our 15W-40 (PCO) API licensed oils should be your choice. If you are looking for an alternative to frequent oil changes or just want the best performing oil for your car, then one of our top tier non-API licensed synthetic oils are for you. Read on, and decide for yourself.

    API Licensing - Passenger Cars - What is it?

    An API (American Petroleum Institute) license indicates that a specific motor oil formulation has passed the minimum performance standards as defined by a series of laboratory bench, physical, chemical and engine tests. These tests were selected and minimum performance standards were set by the API Lubricants Committee to address specific areas such as engine wear, deposits, fuel economy, emissions, etc. The committee is comprised of representatives from automobile, oil and additive companies. The current specification is SJ/GF-2, and in July 2001 the first use of SL/GF-3 will begin.

    Costs

    The cost for running a test program for a single passenger car motor oil formulation is from $125,000 to $300,000, depending on if the formula passes the tests the first time through or requires multiple test runs or formula modifications to achieve a passing average. (That amount goes to $275,000 to $500,000 for a Heavy Duty Diesel licensing program on a specific formula.) Once that testing is complete and the formula has passed all of the minimum requirements, it can be licensed for $825 per year for non-members and $625 per year for members. There is also a small royalty fee per gallon sold for all gallons over one million. The length of time between new specifications is now approximately 2 to 3 years, which does not allow a great deal of time to recover testing costs.

    Who Licenses What Formulas?

    Additive companies, such as Lubrizol, Ethyl,, Infinium and Oronite, develop licensed formulas that they offer to oil companies to re-license. It is inexpensive to re-license one of these formulas, and the majority of oil companies choose to do this to avoid the costs associated with testing. This, however, tends to commoditize the market. The same chemistry is being sold under many brand names. Most of the major oil companies do have their own proprietary formulas developed, tested and licensed. All of AMSOIL INC.'s lubricant formulas are unique and proprietary.

    Flexibility In Manufacturing An API Licensed Formula

    API licensing was originally developed for mineral based oils, and it affords these oils more flexibility than synthetic oils.

    Mineral oils comprised of group I and Group II petroleum basestocks may use a simple program called basestock interchange for added flexibility in manufacturing and purchasing. Interchange means that by completing the proper paperwork and running a few minor engine tests an oil company can choose to buy these petroleum basestocks from many different suppliers. This ensures adequate supply and competitive pricing. However, basestock interchange for Group III and V synthetic basestocks is not allowed. For example, if a formula was tested with an ester (Group V) basestock from a specific supplier, then anyone blending that formula must buy only that supplier's ester. Complete engine testing would need to be performed on the formula using another supplier's ester before an oil company could buy it from that alternative supplier. This additional testing is normally not performed because of the associated costs. This inflexibility makes it very difficult for synthetic lubricant manufacturers to negotiate prices with synthetic basestock suppliers.

    There is also something called viscosity grade read-across. Fortunately, this applies to both petroleum and synthetic basestocks although the better cold temperature performance of synthetics makes it more difficult to achieve in some situations. (That's another whole story.) What this means is that if you properly formulate the lubricant for which you have run all of the API tests, there are guidelines that allow you to use that same formula to make 0W-30, 5W-30, 10W-30, etc. viscosity motor oil.

    Finally, there is a rule for substitutions in the CMA (Chemical Manufacturers Association) code of practice that allows a small degree of flexibility for all formulas. It allows a company to change the percentages of components in the formula by varying amounts from the original formula with limited testing and paperwork requirements. For example, if the licensed formula used 10% of a certain V.I. improver, you would have the ability to utilize from 9% to 11% of the same V.I. improver for your formula.

    Key Limitations For API Licensed Formulas

    Phosphorous content - .10% maximum
    (API SL; 0W-20, 5W-20, 0W-30, 5W-30, 10W-30 viscosity grades, only)

    NOACK volatility - 15% maximum



    The prevalent sources of phosphorous in motor oils are additives called zinc dithiophosphates (ZDTPs). Currently, these versatile additives act as oxidation/corrosion inhibitors and aid in the ability of a lubricant to reduce wear. The automobile manufacturers, however, have demanded that lubricants contain a maximum of only .10% phosphorous. Their reason is that some manufacturers believe that higher phosphorous content levels will poison the catalytic converters on their cars before they reach 150,000 miles, which is the number of miles that their vehicles will be required to pass EPA emission standards. There has not been total agreement within the automotive and lubrication industry about whether phosphorous levels over .10% actually do harm catalytic converters in the long run. What they have failed to make allowances for is the NOACK volatility of an oil.

    The maximum allowable NOACK volatility percentage for the new SL/GF-3 passenger car motor oil specification is 15%. Most of AMSOIL motor oils are in the 5% to 8% NOACK volatility range. Studies have shown there is a correlation between NOACK volatility, oil consumption and the amount of phosphorous from motor oil that will end up in the exhaust gasses. Therefore, oils with higher levels of phosphorous but with low volatility, such as AMSOIL motor oils, present no more risk to catalytic converters than low phosphorous oils with higher NOACK volatility. This has also been demonstrated for years in actual application through state mandated exhaust gas testing on our Dealers' and customers' high mileage vehicles using AMSOIL synthetic motor oils. State inspectors are continually amazed at the low emissions levels generated by vehicles using AMSOIL products. So much for poisoning catalytic converters.

    AMSOIL INC. has determined that the reduced wear and extended drain intervals achievable with phosphorous levels higher than the API limit of .10% are real benefits for the consumer, and pose no risk to catalytic converters. AMSOIL motor oils, except for the API licensed XL-7500 5W-30 and 10W-30 viscosity grades, all have greater than .10% phosphorous levels, and therefore, cannot be API licensed.

    Why Some AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils Are API Licensed And Some Are Not

    1. Full API licensing puts AMSOIL INC. in an inflexible position. Not only would we find it necessary to buy formula components from specific vendors and be at the mercy of their pricing, we would not be able to make any major improvements to the lubricant formulas for 2 to 3 years, without new testing and the associated costs. To solve this problem, the API must establish basestock interchange guidelines for synthetic basestocks just as they have for other basestocks, as well as develop interchange guidelines for other components too.

    2. Full API licensing would impose strict phosphorous limitations on our motor oils. This limitation is the main reason most AMSOIL motor oils are not API licensed. AMSOIL INC. currently disagrees with this limitation and feels strongly that the reduced wear and longer oil and additive life achieved through higher levels of properly balanced phosphorous content is more important than the arbitrary API phosphorous limit that does not give any consideration to the NOACK volatility level of an oil. When chemistry is developed that will provide superior engine wear protection with reduced phosphorous levels, or Noack volatility considerations are put in place, then the phosphorous level will become a non-issue.

    Warranties And API Licensed Motor Oils

    Fortunately, the law does not allow manufacturers to "void your warranty" simply because of the brand of oil you use, the specifications it meets or the miles you drive between oil changes. To be specific, they cannot deny to fix your broken radio, faulty valve or cracked piston because you used an AMSOIL non-API licensed motor oil, or because you've gone more than 3000 miles since your last oil change. Denial of warranty coverage must be specifically due to an oil related failure. All courts of law will find against any manufacturer or dealership that tries these warranty shenanigans. If any automobile dealership insinuates that your warranty will be void if you use AMSOIL products or utilize extended drain intervals, let AMSOIL INC. know the name of the Dealership, the address, the owner's name and the name of the employee that made this statement. Mail to:

    AMSOIL INC.
    Attention: Technical Services Department
    AMSOIL Building
    Superior, WI 54880

    or e-mail to tech@amsoil.com.

    They will almost never put it in writing, but if they do, please send us a copy of that, too. Either way, we will send them a letter informing them cease the intimidation of our customers.

    Only if the oil is determined to be the direct cause of the engine problem can a manufacturer or dealership deny warranty coverage for that specific problem. In this situation the AMSOIL warranty would apply, and the AMSOIL Technical Services Department would assist you in processing your claim and in getting the vehicle repaired. That's our pledge to you. AMSOIL INC. sells millions of gallons of oil per year and warranty claims are a rare occurrence. If you ever have a warranty problem with an automobile manufacturer or dealership, AMSOIL will assist you by analyzing the problem and providing data supporting the fact that repairs should be made under the vehicle manufacturer's warranty. If this does not resolve the problem, AMSOIL will submit a claim with our insurance company and request that an adjuster have the vehicle repaired and pursue legal settlement later if necessary. The fact is there never has been an engine failure attributed to the non-performance of AMSOIL products, and we do not expect there ever will be. If it ever did, both AMSOIL and our insurance company would make certain your problem was resolved.

    How Does AMSOIL INC. Ensure Their Products Meet Or Exceed The Minimum Specifications Of The Tests Required For API Licensing?

    First, AMSOIL INC. works closely with major additive companies to select the top performing, and usually most expensive, passenger car and heavy duty diesel motor oil additives. These additives have already passed all of the API licensing requirements in a petroleum or synthetic based formulation. Then we work with the additive company to maximize the amount of additive used and to boost the additive package in selected performance areas to achieve an optimum performing additive package for reduced wear and extended drain intervals. This is unlike the vast majority of companies who, because additives are expensive, use the minimum amount of the least expensive additives required to meet the minimum API requirements.

    We then utilize a blend of synthetic basestocks with known performance characteristics as a replacement for the petroleum basestocks to optimize performance in areas of lubricity, volatility, viscosity index, oxidation and nitration resistance, pour points, flash points, deposit control, soot handling, emissions, etc. We also will utilize a highly shear stable V.I. improver to ensure viscosity retention throughout extended drain intervals. This replaces the inexpensive and less shear stable V.I. improver used in the API licensed petroleum formula. We do laboratory bench tests before running field tests to verify the superiority of the synthetic formula in actual use. We also continue to monitor the performance of the oil through close scrutiny of tens of thousands of oil analysis tests per year across a wide variety of vehicles all around North America and the World. AMSOIL INC. has been collecting used synthetic oil samples from passenger cars since 1982. No other oil company has such a vast data base of the performance of synthetic lubricants over extended drain intervals.

    AMSOIL INC.'s products and formulations outperform API licensed oils. They're engineered that way. Period.

    Conclusion

    AMSOIL INC. takes pride in never having conformed to industry norms or standards when those standards are contrary to peak performance. We introduced synthetics to the automotive world in 1972 with the first synthetic motor oil to exceed API performance specifications. At that time other manufacturers refused to recognize the superior performance of synthetic motor oils. Now, however, most companies sell synthetic lubricants, vehicles are factory filled with synthetic motor oils and gear lubes, and some manufacturers even offer extended warranties if you use synthetics. AMSOIL has always offered extended drain intervals because the oil was capable of performing for extended drains, and it was the right thing to do for the consumer. Now the entire industry is moving in that direction. Ironically, it was recently published that automotive manufacturers will be recommending extended drain intervals of up to 15,000 miles in the near future because that's what consumers want.

    AMSOIL is a company of firsts. That doesn't happen by always conforming to industry norms and standards.

    API licensing of lubricants is voluntary, and it ensures automobile manufacturers and consumers that the product meets a set of minimum standards. Should these standards, in the future, be raised to a level consistent with AMSOIL's standards for motor oil performance, AMSOIL will consider licensing all oils. For those that feel pressured to use an API licensed product, we have them and encourage you to use them (XLT, XLF and PCO). AMSOIL does offer better performing motor oils that are not API licensed for all of the reasons explained in this response. They provide our customers with alternatives to the commodity products typically available in the market today. If you want the convenience of extended drain intervals or the top performance from your vehicle, AMSOIL has taken time to engineer the very best money can buy.


    [ 01-15-2003: Message edited by: elcamino ]</p>

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Wainscott,new york, United States
    Posts
    121

    Post

    I switched last change to DELVAC all around. Where are the AMSOIL guys we used to hear from? "A good DEFENSE is your best offense".

    Boomerhd
    \"SEEYAINTHEREARVIEW\"<p><br />2001 2500HD D/A CC/SB LT BLUE.<br /> <br />SUPER-JUICED<br />MOBIL SYNTH. B/B<br />FPPF EVERY FILL<br />FUMOTO VALVE<br />AMSOIL AIR<br />1 PIECE SHAFT<br />JK HEADLIGHT KIT<br />ISSPRO EV GUAGES<br />LIMO TINT<br />MACHINE GUN AIRBOX<br />4\" EXHAUST <br />VEVET RIDES<br />2\" BLOCKS<br />TORSION TORQUE<br />BILSTIEN\'S<br />HELLWIG REAR ANTI-SWAY<br />PERAGON BED COVER<br />PRO-COMP EXTERRAIN 305 70/R16<br />POWDER COAT BLACK 16/8 RIMS<br />\"RANCH HAND\" ALL\'ROUND<br />MEMBER# 5405

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    13,576

    Thumbs down

    All y'all (that means everybody) that feel like they have a need to grab a torch and hunt down the witch should do so immediately! Don't let yourself be left out because someone yells witchery! That the way we do it......over 300 years ago!

    Not being one to just blindly "follow the crowd", I am not satisfied with one person's UNINFORMED OPINION. Or that of the band wagon jumpers, for that matter. I find no credibility in the claims made, that satisfies my requirements for a "witch hunt".

    The API's Licensee database is expansive, and misleading if taken out of context. I found several Amsoil motor oil products, both gas and Diesel rated, listed as an APPROVED (read--CERTIFIED) Licensee. I did not find a Diesel rated Amsoil 5w-30 oil. All other Amsoil motor oils (listed on their online store, or the catalog I have in my possession) are there. They (API) list Amsoil 5w-30/SL as approved.

    Amsoil lists a "Synthetic 5w-30 motor oil" AND a "Series 3000 Heavy Duty Diesel 5w-30 motor oil". The claims of service applications are different between the two, and they have different part numbers. The former (Synthetic 5w-30)) is in no way, ever, represented as an approved or recommended Diesel engine oil.

    Could it be possible that the API Licensee listing is not showing the product in question for reasons other that what has been alleged? Perhaps the list was last updated the day before the Series 3000 5w-30 was approved. We could come up with dozens of reasons, using the same method of deduction that has been used to claim that they are in violation of the API licensing requirements, as well of several US commercialization laws. I could not find any FACTS that would PROVE otherwise. Do all of you also burn products that are labeled "patent pending"?

    The API Certification Requirements clearly state that a certified product MAY display the symbols, and that all products that display the symbols are approved by API. Nowhere does it imply (that I could find) that the symbol(s) MUST be displayed on a product. I understand that to mean that a product that displays the symbol(s) are approved, and products that are approved may/may not display the symbol(s). I fail to see how it could be more complicated than that. None of the Amsoil motor oil products that I have in my possession at this time have an API symbol. All of them do state that they exceed the API requirements of their advertised application, including the Fully Synthetic 15w-40 Heavy Duty Diesel and Marine oil, and Fully Synthetic 10w-30 Motor Oil. Their reason for not displaying the symbol when they can is curios, but doesn't make any kind of statement. Any statement perceived is just that. Perceived.

    I use Amsoil products, almost exclusively. I will continue to do so until I see some real proof that it is an inferior product. I am not saying that any other product is inferior to Amsoil. Just that it is my choice.

    Amsoil, or any agent of Amsoil, does not, in any way, compensate me for supporting or defending their product or interests. My interest in their products is purely personal.

    Anyone in this day and age that would open this thread in such a manner, in my opinion, is in very poor taste. Not to mention openining a real possibility of some legal responsibility. This forum is a copyrighted, published public publication.

    It would not surprise me one bit if this entire thread is closed or sensored before I even click the "Add Reply" button. The start of the thread is not only in contrast with the rules of the forum, that all of us should have read when we signed up, but could be a serious legal liability to the publisher (MP).

    I am very dissapointed with what I have read from many of the valuable contributors on this forum. Juvenile, for the lack of a better term.

    I'm done. Dunk me. Burn me at the stake. Whatever.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
    Posts
    281

    Post

    Just want to address a couple of points made in this discussion. First to Bigwheel regarding Jim Bigley's comment. Amsoil does CLAIM that their marine 15W40 fully synthetic oil exceeds several API ratings, but it is not CERTIFIED as such. You are just taking Amsoil's word for it. API is not saying that it meets any rating... only Amsoil. Big difference! Anybody could sell a motor oil that CLAIMS to meet API CH-4 rating, but they better not sell it as API Certified.

    Next for elcamino... I'm glad you posted the information from Amsoil. The only problem is that it's full of holes. More doublespeak (I wish I had the time to discect the entire column... maybe later). One of the most creative excuses I've ever read is the Amsoil statement that their oil wouldn't be as good if it met API Certification requirements. This statement would be more correctly worded as "our fully synthetic diesel oils do not meet API Certification requirements".

    You Diesel Supplement makes it clear that you are required to use API Certified oil.

    Another couple of statements that Amsoil made are just plain crazy: "Denial of warranty coverage must be specifically due to an oil related failure. All courts of law will find against any manufacturer or dealership that tries these warranty shenanigans." The laws covering manufacturer warranty coverage and exclusions are pretty clear. If you use an aftermarket product that meets or exceeds the manufacturers specification they can not deny warranty coverage. In this case if you used Amsoil you are NOT using a product that meets the manufacturers specifications. You would then be faced with the task of forcing Amsoil to admit their product caused a problem. Good luck. As for the statement about "all courts"... is way out there. I know what happens in court rooms and there is NOTHING that ALL courts would agree on... especially a sitaution like this that would cleary be in favor of the manufacturer. Then you would get the pleasure of suing Amsoil... good luck.

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Kent, Connecticut
    Posts
    639

    Arrow

    Mac, Bill...........

    Soooooooooo Now we find out that Pinochio is doing Amsoils claims.

    I'll stick with Dino every 3K miles and my dirt passing K&N Filter too .

    Anytime I see claims from a company like Amsoil my guard goes up. I won't knock anybody that wants to use that OIL, but if you go in for a big warranty bill for a blown motor and you have to produce receipts....GOOD LUCK!!!!!.wait till they check out when they got their oil approved, if they did.

    I'll keep letting the Stealer put GM approved oil, filters and there own documented labor in my 43K truck.

    My last truck is one that is still on the road at over 15 years old and over 313,000 miles. Thanks to Dino oil and K&N air filter.

    GMC

    [ 01-15-2003: Message edited by: GMC-2002-Dmax ]</p>
    <b>\'02 2500HD - 435 RWHP/774 LB-FT on #2 ONLY..<br />HOT Juice,VA Box,Predator,AFE Stage II,Banks 4\"<br />RS9000\'s,Deep Pan,H2\'s & Pro-Comp 33\"<br /><a href=\"http://community.webshots.com/user/gmc2002dmax\" target=\"_blank\">Pics</a><br /><a href=\"mailto:gmc2002duramax@earthlink.net\">gmc20 02duramax@earthlink.net</a></b>

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    13,576

    Thumbs down

    Quote (in part):
    "Amsoil does CLAIM that their marine 15W40 fully synthetic oil exceeds several API ratings, but it is not CERTIFIED as such. You are just taking Amsoil's word for it. API is not saying that it meets any rating... only Amsoil. Big difference! Anybody could sell a motor oil that CLAIMS to meet API CH-4 rating, but they better not sell it as API Certified."

    The API website lists several Amsoil engine oils as being Approved/Certified. One of which is Amsoil 15w-40 Heavy Duty Desiel and Marine Motor Oil.

    It's there. Don't take my word for it. If you did your research, as you claim, you would have found it, as I did. Not difficult. Just a little time consuming. It is listed in every category that pertains to its claimed properties.

    http://www.api.org/cgi-bin/eolcs.cgi

    Like I said. Don't take my word for it.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
    Posts
    281

    Post

    DmaxMaverick... not to be crude, but you must be dreaming! As I posted before, Amsoil has ONLY two oils API Certified: Their XL-7500 products and the PCO synthetic BLEND diesel oil.

    I have verified this on their web site and via telephone. Amsoil has no certifications pending as of yesterday.

    Want to prove it to yourself? Here ya go:

    Every API Certified product containing "Amsoil":
    http://www.api.org/cgi-bin/eolcs_li.cgi?o=C&b=Amsoil

    Every API Certified product containing "marine":
    http://www.api.org/cgi-bin/eolcs_li.cgi?o=C&b=marine

    No matches for the product you claimed. Could you post the exact URL where you found your listing?

    [ 01-15-2003: Message edited by: csimo ]</p>

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Minneapolis, MN
    Posts
    44

    Unhappy

    MOREPOWER ANY SUGGESTIONS?????

    CSIMO...You have made a really good point, thanks for investigating this to a T, I was at the stealer last week for a check-up, everything was great. just turned 5,000 miles, and I asked about other Synthetic oils, bended or not blended. I asked about Amsoil, they said, not really sure because they don't want to say if it's ok or not. I agree with your point about the CERTIFIED point, they only point I wanted to mention, even if it's not Certified, the oil has to be determined the cause of the defect, meaning any oil brand name, weather it's clasifications, it still has to be found to be oil related. You have found some great stuff on Amsoil, and I commend you on your effort and work, it's getting too confusing and Frustrating WHO'S RIGHT and WHO's WRONG. Who sign's my warranty check when I have a mechaincal problem. The manual does specify API CERTIFIED oil. Thanks
    2002 Chev Dmax/Allison cc/sb,Summit White, BF Goodrich 265,75R-16, SS sep bars, Truxedo Pics-http://www.pbase.com/bigwheel/new_dmax

  17. #37
    jbplock Guest

    Post

    DmaxMaverick,

    Just to clarify

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Feb 2000
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    11,398

    Arrow

    I checked a gallon jug of Amsoil Marine 15W-40 Synthetic I have on hand, and saw the following declaration on the label.

    "API Service
    CG-4 CF CF-2 SJ SH"

    There was no API certification symbol that I could find.

    I assumed Amsoil Series 3000 5W-30 and the Marine 15W-40 synthetics were API certified.

    Otherwise, I would request that everyone post reliable and verifiable information. It does no one any good otherwise. Just the facts….

    I will make the offer to Amsoil (the corporation or any dealer who advertises here) to offer a rebuttal. We could also produce an editorial that adds information about this issue, if it would be of service to both the industry and the consumers.

    MP

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    56

    Post

    Next for elcamino... I'm glad you posted the information from Amsoil. The only problem is that it's full of holes. More doublespeak (I wish I had the time to discect the entire column... maybe later). One of the most creative excuses I've ever read is the Amsoil statement that their oil wouldn't be as good if it met API Certification requirements. This statement would be more correctly worded as "our fully synthetic diesel oils do not meet API Certification requirements".

    I doubt anything they (or anyone else) says or did would convince you, you have formed an opinion and you are not going to budge.

    Just don't use the product, it that simple in this is an issue. I don't think you have to take on the mission of instructing all of us in how to maintain our vehicles.

    Make sure that everything else on your truck is safe from having your warranty voided. No oversize tires, computer chips, after market exhaust, jake brakes, etc.

    btw
    I am proud to admit I have used Amsoil since 1975 in every new GM vehicle I have ever owned and its in the 2 vehicles listed below and its not the API oil, 0W30 and 10W-30 in LS1. I have never had an engine problem in any GM vehicle since my first new car, a 1970 Chevelle SS454 (LS5).
    2002 Pontiac Trans AM WS6 (Ram Air LS1) Pewter<br />2001 GMC SLT X-Cab Polo Green

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Tulsa
    Posts
    74

    Post

    Just so everyone doesn't have to surf all over the web for some of the info being discussed, the following information was obtained from links given previously-
    http://www.api.org/cgi-bin/eolcs_li.cgi?k=767 (csimo)
    http://www.api.org/cgi-bin/eolcs_li.cgi?n=amsoil (ndamico)
    http://www.api.org/cgi-bin/eolcs.cgi (DmaxMaverick)

    &gt;&gt;&gt; All links will get you (eventually) to the same API web page!!

    Amsoil has these products that are licensed to use the API Service Symbol (aka donut):
    AMSOIL PCO 15W-40 CI-4/SL
    AMSOIL XL-7500 10W-30 SL*
    AMSOIL XL-7500 10W-40 SL
    AMSOIL XL-7500 5W-20 SL*
    AMSOIL XL-7500 5W-30 SL*
    *Energy Conserving

    Amsoil has these products that are licensed to use the API Certification Mark (aka starburst):
    AMSOIL XL-7500 10W-30
    AMSOIL XL-7500 5W-20
    AMSOIL XL-7500 5W-30

    ***
    *****
    The following is my observation and is NOT to be considered to be derived from the above API resources!!
    *****
    ***
    Since I don't have any actual product to view, I went to Amsoil's website (www.amsoil.com) and looked at the photos they supply of their product containers. Unfortunately, they re-used the 5W-30 photo for the 5W-20 and 10W-30 links, so it's impossible for me to comment on those two weights. But the 5W-30 container does have the API "starburst" printed on the front label. I also viewed the PCO 15W-40 container. It has the API "donut" printed on the front label. I noted that PCO is the Amsoil product code for the synthetic blend 15W-40 diesel oil.

    While there, I viewed the photos of the full synthetic HD diesel oil containers. None displayed either the service symbol (donut) or the certification mark (starburst).

    Finally, I couldn't help but notice that most of the NON-LICENSED products had some kind of "circular" pattern similar in shape & size to the API licensing donut &/or starburst. Inside these circles were the API certifications that the product claims to meet or exceed. I know we are supposed to keep this factual, but I find this to be a deliberate attempt at deception. If one were to only glance at these product labels, you could mistakenly believe they are API licensed when they are not.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •