Camaro 6.5L TD project

[Rafedial1]

Music to the ears!

That'll scare those kids at the stoplight in their Hondas with the coffee can mufflers!

Thanks!!!

Glad you like.

I love this country and would never hesitate to display my pride

would like to note:
I purposefully went out of my way to use as many U.S.A. parts as possible. Often Gm or AcDelco originals. In my short years i have heard nothing but headaches from China parts. Down to my toggle switches I just couldn't do it. I trust to not always get the lowest price, but certainly the best quality. My Thanks goes out to those men/women for keepin' it real.

[6.5 Detroit Diesel]

That is one of the coolest projects I have ever seen. I might be a little biased as I am a 6.5 man, but all that aside, wow. I will be showing this video to my buddies.

Quick question, it didn't look like the plenum was hooked up?

[Rafedial1]

Thanks Detroit,

no the intake plenum is open, still working on the cold side of the turbo. Having trouble trying to get everything tucked up out of the way for ground clearance. I'm sure it would run better if it was.

Today:
Let the car get up to full temp today, idles at 650 rpm, and won't go hotter than about 200, with NO Fans and car not moving. Turn the fans on and it goes down to 180 quick.This was the biggest hurdle with the project, cooling, and i kicked *ss.

The turbo seems to lag a little when engine/exhaust is cold. As the heatsoak and exhaust energy rise, the turbo spools better. Can't wait to put a load on her.

The Bad:
I have a weeping freeze plug (right behind the solid motor mount)
1 drip every minute or so when at full engine temp. What should I do?

Getting some blow-by out the Tuna Can, vented to atmosphere. How much is too much?

Oil pressure at full engine temp WAS right around 20 psi. I noticed it was idling at 540-550 rpms so I raised it to 650, now oil psi is 25 at idle, full operating temp. Enough?


Otherwise NO fluid LEAKS!


Cody

[DmaxMaverick]

Nice job!

Nothing wrong with your oil pressure, even down to 10 PSI at hot idle. As long as it comes up under load and higher RPM's. It doesn't hurt to have the idle a little higher, but it wastes fuel, significantly.

Replace that plug, or try some "Cadillac Pills". They are a cooling system sealer GM carries, and is compatible with Dex-Cool, and the green stuff. I don't recommend most off-the-shelf sealers.

The blow-by is hard to call without an actual cylinder and/or crankcase pressure test. The vapor puffs from the CDR can seem significant, even when completely normal. New and really old engines display more. It could be your choice of motor oil, too. You should have a filter and/or condenser installed at the outlet if open to atmosphere.

[Rafedial1]

Thanks Maverick

Now that i think about it the blow-by isn't excessive. Oil pressure is good. Using Rot 15w-40, got about 5-6 hours run time so far, looks clean+no usage.

Mav, your sayin' to ask for "Cadillac pills" at the Gm parts counter? What's in em?

Here are some finished exhaust pics. My standards for exhaust are set pretty high. Fitment, clearances, routing, sound, blah, blah. I've been messin with exhaust design since young. My amateur welding skills help here as well. Turned out ok. No leaks.

Cody

[DmaxMaverick]

The "Cadillac Pills" are a cooling system sealer (they have an official name, but I don't know it, only the common name). Not unlike, in appearance, some other off-the-shelf remedies. I haven't used them, but know of several GM techs and shop owners who swear by them. Some Cadillac models include their use after head/gasket or other open cooling system repairs, in the repair procedure. I don't know if they are used from the factory, though.

At some time, the freeze plug needs to be replaced (better too soon, than too late). Sealers and rubber expansion plugs are band-aids.

[Rafedial1]

Mav, grabbed some of those Cadillac pills from the dealer and sure as sh**, it worked.

Thanks

[Rafedial1]

the bills caught up to me, the car is over budget

If i plan on marketing the car I will need to raise my retail price. It doesn't look like I can build anymore of these cars with any profit.

All I was trying to do is prove to myself an American car CAN have great mileage and power at a regular 4 door economy sedan price.

Vast research and part compatibility did keep my overall costs low, but the minor details have me by the balls. Now she has fuel leaks. Too much lift pump?

I managed to sell enough 6.5L and F-body parts to offset the overall, but gaskets, fittings, and little crap adds up.

No new progress for the week, maybe two weeks... bummin...

[john8662]

Really neat, just had to pop in...

Just one question really, why so big on the exhaust up to the turbolader?

Really, 3" OD (2 7/8" ID) would be perfect after the "Y", and I'd do right at 2 1/4" OD (2 1/8" ID, same as outlet ID on donut on manifolds) before the "Y" to maintain good spoolability. But for the track, if you have some lag you can just keep the 1600RPM Stall converter and you'll be able to build pretty good boost in your stall-up.

Exhaust is a PITA though...

Keep it up, I'm so glad you tossed a nasty 'ol gasser and put in a real engine. I seriously hate gasoline engines, can't stand the smell and how they work!

[Rafedial1]

Really neat, just had to pop in...

Just one question really, why so big on the exhaust up to the turbolader?

Really, 3" OD (2 7/8" ID) would be perfect after the "Y", and I'd do right at 2 1/4" OD (2 1/8" ID, same as outlet ID on donut on manifolds) before the "Y" to maintain good spoolability. But for the track, if you have some lag you can just keep the 1600RPM Stall converter and you'll be able to build pretty good boost in your stall-up.

Exhaust is a PITA though...

Keep it up, I'm so glad you tossed a nasty 'ol gasser and put in a real engine. I seriously hate gasoline engines, can't stand the smell and how they work!

I appreciate the kinds words John.

The exhaust is 2.5" before the Y, 3 inch after the Y all the way to the turbo. It's just an illusion. The exhaust is completely wrapped in some header wrap from the manifolds back, looks larger in diameter. Keeps the combustion heat/energy up and supposedly helps with spool time. just a little trick I learned from Camaro guys with STS butt mount turbos.

After hearing this thing come to life I am officially addicted for life!!

[Rafedial1]

Decided to attack the fuel leaks.

I noticed when running today the car was leaking fuel in two different places, one more than before. I knew the manifold had to come off. one problem, even the top manifold could not be removed without lowering the engine (contact with cowl) I thought I would have to remove the whole k-member with engine/trans attached. Sit and think....

Came up with a simple plan to get me some room with the intake man.
Unbolt 6 k-member bolts (leave struts bolted) and disconnect the steering Coupler, raise car. well, it worked.

Removed the manifold/serp belt/alt bracket and started her up. Fuel leaking out of #8 injection line at the pump, it was loose, the second time this has happened. Checked line-to-injector, no leaks. BUT!!!



On the passengers side the injector return lines are leaking, well.... seeping. The drives side is dry as a bone.

Lift pump the culprit? Too much supply volume/press????
The lift pump I am using was set at 6.5 psi, 120 gph. Put a pressure gauge on the fuel drain and adjusted lift pump (internal reg) to the recommen 4.5-5 psi. Well the return lines still leak on pass side.

My thoughts
-prob too much lift pump, trying to return excess fuel at idle (it's gone push/leak out somehwere>? Excess fuel bad for lift pump??

-or the routing of the fuel lines (fuel tank at higher elevation than engine)(a.ka. fighting gravity. I noticed on the c2500 pulled motor from, the return DOES have the help of gravity. Electric return fuel pump???

-Fixed injection line leaks, car runs 100% smoother.
-fuggin weaping freeze plug
-could these solid engine mounts be vibrating the car apart? loctite all bolts

Included a couple pics of the manifold since it is off.
Is the top intake the L65? What makes it the designation L65?

Took a look at the manifolds with the CDR port on it. should I drill/tap for a hose barb fitting and attach it to the intake? This atmosphere vent is not so eco-enviro.

Port the intake? i've ported a set of cast iron heads and one aluminum set. Turned out alright on the flow bench and the cars they were installed in.

Suspension: let the car sit at ride height, and my oil pan skid plate is about four inches off the ground May fab some 1/2"-1" strut spacers, yes a lift for the Camaro. Yet, it doesn't sit any lower than any 4th gen V8 F-body w/lowering springs. I ahve dealt with the issues of Lontube headers on a lowered LS1 F-body, my old one. I had Eibach springs about 2 inch drop and pacesetters. Bad bumps on the highway would casue a ball of sparks. Not good, but 2 years of driving and being careful I never blew through the pipe.

but with this car I don't want to be careful. I want to drive it like I stole it. Everyday. I guess we'll find out.

that is all.



Cody

[93GMCSierra]

Decided to attack the fuel leaks.

I noticed when running today the car was leaking fuel in two different places, one more than before. I knew the manifold had to come off. one problem, even the top manifold could not be removed without lowering the engine (contact with cowl) I thought I would have to remove the whole k-member with engine/trans attached. Sit and think....

Came up with a simple plan to get me some room with the intake man.
Unbolt 6 k-member bolts (leave struts bolted) and disconnect the steering Coupler, raise car. well, it worked.

Removed the manifold/serp belt/alt bracket and started her up. Fuel leaking out of #8 injection line at the pump, it was loose, the second time this has happened. Checked line-to-injector, no leaks. BUT!!!



On the passengers side the injector return lines are leaking, well.... seeping. The drives side is dry as a bone.

Lift pump the culprit? Too much supply volume/press????
The lift pump I am using was set at 6.5 psi, 120 gph. Put a pressure gauge on the fuel drain and adjusted lift pump (internal reg) to the recommen 4.5-5 psi. Well the return lines still leak on pass side.

My thoughts
-prob too much lift pump, trying to return excess fuel at idle (it's gone push/leak out somehwere>? Excess fuel bad for lift pump??

-or the routing of the fuel lines (fuel tank at higher elevation than engine)(a.ka. fighting gravity. I noticed on the c2500 pulled motor from, the return DOES have the help of gravity. Electric return fuel pump???

-Fixed injection line leaks, car runs 100% smoother.
-fuggin weaping freeze plug
-could these solid engine mounts be vibrating the car apart? loctite all bolts

Included a couple pics of the manifold since it is off.
Is the top intake the L65? What makes it the designation L65?

Took a look at the manifolds with the CDR port on it. should I drill/tap for a hose barb fitting and attach it to the intake? This atmosphere vent is not so eco-enviro.

Port the intake? i've ported a set of cast iron heads and one aluminum set. Turned out alright on the flow bench and the cars they were installed in.

Suspension: let the car sit at ride height, and my oil pan skid plate is about four inches off the ground May fab some 1/2"-1" strut spacers, yes a lift for the Camaro. Yet, it doesn't sit any lower than any 4th gen V8 F-body w/lowering springs. I ahve dealt with the issues of Lontube headers on a lowered LS1 F-body, my old one. I had Eibach springs about 2 inch drop and pacesetters. Bad bumps on the highway would casue a ball of sparks. Not good, but 2 years of driving and being careful I never blew through the pipe.

but with this car I don't want to be careful. I want to drive it like I stole it. Everyday. I guess we'll find out.

that is all.



Cody

This one I can help you with your other problems not so much..
The intake does not have an EGR which is a good thing.

[Rafedial1]

The posts about the issues with the car are superficial. What is realy important here is showing the viewers that almost anything is possible.

Read some facts about our country's current economic situation just empowers me more to speak my mind.

Diesel, specifically Bio-diesel is a very versatile fuel. Since commencing the Camaro project I have discovered this fact. Through my research I believe it is possible to use Diesel fuel to provide energy to more than just our vehicles. Our home's heat, electricity, and yearly income can truly be supplemented/supported by the use/growth of Bio-Diesel fuel/soybean oil/SVO. The American Farmers are such a great importance to our country's success already.


Recently I have seen post of single engine diesel generators that can support the energy usage of 10 houses. Not to mention solar energy and wind energy capabilities. If we need a way to sustain existence without our dependance on government intervetion/support, we do have other options. The fluctuation that occurs with our economic standards can be avoided when we create a way to depend on ourselves. The mind is a powerful thing.



Cody

[Rafedial1]

Quick question, it didn't look like the plenum was hooked up?

After much headache and time the cold side is complete. Ground clearance is the best i could get. Here are some pictures while in mockup stage. The whole charge pipe will be one piece, with one silicone coupler at each end of the car.

I kept cost down by using aluminized exhaust tubing. Picked up a bnuch of bends in 14 and 16 gauge, 22, 45, 90, S-bends off a dealer on Ebay for a bargain.

Brake system is complete.


A test drive is very near!!




Cody

[DmaxMaverick]

Wow! With all that pipe, you almost don't need a CAC. I wonder what the BTU exchange rate is on all that surface area???

[6.5 Detroit Diesel]

Should help to lower on it's own, thats for sure.

I can't remember if you had said where you got your CAC from in previous posts.

[Rafedial1]

Wow! With all that pipe, you almost don't need a CAC. I wonder what the BTU exchange rate is on all that surface area???

Good point. you got me thinkin'. The pipe is open to air current underneath the car. Like a heat sink, right?

[Rafedial1]

Should help to lower on it's own, thats for sure.

I can't remember if you had said where you got your CAC from in previous posts.

Ebay. CXracing, bar-n-plate. rated at less than 1 psi loss. Cheap.

For the next Camaro I build, it will prob be air-to-water intercooled.

[DmaxMaverick]

Good point. you got me thinkin'. The pipe is open to air current underneath the car. Like a heat sink, right?

Like a heat sink. The exposed area of 8' of 3" pipe will be approximately 912^2" (114^2"/ft.). The air under the car won't be as "fresh", or as volumetric as up front, and the heat conduction rate of aluminized steel is less than just aluminum, but it will definitely have an effect. In any case, you have about the effectiveness of 2 CAC's. Not a bad thing, IMO.

In hindsight, you could have designed the system with only the pipe used for cooling. Maybe something for the future. It would really cut a chunk off the cost. Straight sections of extruded/finned aluminum pipe can be had, for not much. Hmmmmmmm.

If you are going through all that trouble for the A-A CAC, you might as well use a A-L CAC. A little extra weight in the trunk won't hurt. But, cost will be a factor.

[Rafedial1]

Like a heat sink. The exposed area of 8' of 3" pipe will be approximately 912^2" (114^2"/ft.). The air under the car won't be as "fresh", or as volumetric as up front, and the heat conduction rate of aluminized steel is less than just aluminum, but it will definitely have an effect. In any case, you have about the effectiveness of 2 CAC's. Not a bad thing, IMO.

In hindsight, you could have designed the system with only the pipe used for cooling. Maybe something for the future. It would really cut a chunk off the cost. Straight sections of extruded/finned aluminum pipe can be had, for not much. Hmmmmmmm.

If you are going through all that trouble for the A-A CAC, you might as well use a A-L CAC. A little extra weight in the trunk won't hurt. But, cost will be a factor.

Hmmmm.... is right. Air-to water in the trunk would help with weight characteristics. Heat exchanger in the front or underneath the rear of the car, simple electric coolant pump. Something like that.

Extruded finned Aluminum tubing. Like the PMD coolers for the 6.5L but for the charge pipe>? Aluminum itself would increase the heat dissipation. Interesting....

I wish i left the IAT sensor in the manifold and had a way to measure intake temp during operation.

What is methanol injection? I don't quite understand how it all works?


Cody